Global warming is a natural event and the effects are not all bad, two respected researchers claimed yesterday.

Yeah, I kinda like it when the sun comes up, and it gets warm, in the spring and summer. As I've stated all along, "it's the sun!!!"

Great commentary, Mark, and yes, the troll pukes will attack the messenger. In your case, they'll probably go after your faith.

btw, I still get no "sign out" prompt, and I'd like to get rid of my long TypeKey name. What gives?

Libs long to return to the dark days of the Little Ice Age, which is scientifically linked to the start of the Black Death, which killed, scientists think, around 75 million humans.

I'm a global warming skeptic, I tend to take the George Carlin view: the earth will survive us. (My best guess for human extinction is a widespread lethal mosquito-borne illness unchecked only because we're too stubborn to responsibly use tiny amounts of DDT because it was a mistake when we used huge amounts of DDT in the past.) But three slides from Al Gore's road show sting me: Showing a huge chunk of Antarctica gone, which leads to, showing South Florida, where I live, under water. The last is the graph of human population over time. And I think traffic is bad now.

thats right Mark - people who believe in Global Warming are all socialists who want to take over the world. Same for people who believe in that insane "evolution scandal" as well?

Never mind that Dennis Avery also argues that organic food is dangerous, Never mind that he works for the Hudson Institute - a conservative think which is funded primarily by large corporations that directly profit from us ignoring the problem. Of course Mark will say that this is "attacking the author" - Sorry Mark its bothering to do research on where the claims are coming from . Attacking the author would be endless calling someone "asshat" - but you don't have a problem with that because "its funny".

Who do you think you are kidding - its a joke.

It's funny... I'm actually taking a class on Environmental Ethics this semester, and, though I consider myself somewhat of an environmentalist (look up "green libertarianism" on wikipedia), I think that the class is ridiculous. The whole purpose of the class is to find ways to morally look at nonhuman individuals without resorting to human interests, but the only arguments that I have read for that class that aren't circular or beliefs from belief/ignorance ("I'm right because you can't prove me wrong!") do just that. I guess my point is that you don't have to buy into hyperbolic rhetoric and shady arguments in order to believe in a certain cause.

I don't think that Global Warming is going to destroy the world, but I do believe that it is contributing to droughts, stronger storms, wildfires, and the spread of some diseases. I don't believe that we all need to ride our bikes everywhere and halt the economy, but I think that it's a moral imperative for us to cut down on consumption and pollution. There are common-sense ways for us to deal with problems facing our society, and fixing one problem usually does worlds to mitigate others.

I don't hate or get angry with people who disagree with me on global warming, but I get quite annoyed when they use that disagreement as a defense of the status-quo.

that should be "arguments from belief/ignorance" this is what happens when you don't get enough sleep...

Rana,

I, too, believe we should cut down on consumption - because consumerism, in and of itself, is sinful. Doesn't matter if it were entirely clean, we still shouldn't consume as much as we do today. Of course, I must plead: Guilty. I, too, am caught up in the consumerist modern culture...

What I think the problem is vis a vis environmentalism is that, for its proponents, it has become a substitute for religion - in place of the Father, they have put Mother Earth. Better, in my view, to not believe in God than to believe that our planet is something more than just a part of the passing physical world, of no intrinsic value whatsoever (it only has value because we live on it - absent us, and the whole things is a waste of time and resources). What this has done is turn them into zealots for the cause - but since the basic concept isn't true (the world is not something to be preserved "forever"), this had led them to a series of lies in defense of their worldview - such as, most infamously, that global warming is a catastrophe and that we must stop it from happening.

I want to stop polluting because pollution is just not good - just as I wish my house to be clean, I wish the world to be clean, too. On the other hand, I'm not going to stop to vacuum the floor when I've got a family member who needs to be taken to the hospital.

Liberal,

But you still won't confront the argument - neither mine, nor the authors quoted in the article...you just made ad-hominem attacks.

Doesn't this, at least some times, appear a bit weak to you?

warming n cooling are historical.

greenhouse gases MAY somehow effect & NOT cause.

stewardship of the environment is conservative.

extremists & profiteers cannot be allowed to frame the discussion.

the northwest passage is open for business.

Nor does Fat Al Gore want to debate the "proven science". Nor will he ever debate. He knows the BS he presented [his proven science] would be taken down in a second by real science. But he [Al] is the messiah to empty skulls like LiberalT and CO.

Nor does Francois Kerry want to release his military record as he stated he would on numerous occassions. He knows the Swiftboaters were correct. And he won't sue them as he threatened on numerous occassions. Discovery would prove him a liar and Swiftboaters truth tellers. He also knows the empty skulls will mindlessly follow the messiah. CO and LT, Francois and Fat Al thank you for your mindless support.

Mark, your point about pollution is like the one I have been making even way back before I started blogging: we should be more concerned with the real threats to the environment, in the way of pollution, stripping forests, etc, and so on, rather then the fanciful, farcical, and fantasy of global warming as caused by Man.

I want clean water so that I can surf without red tide and bags of blood in the water (seen both.) I detest those wave rider things, as they always seem to leave a trail of water craft oil and gas.

Issues like deforestation, over fishing, clear cutting (different from deforstation,) burn management, loss of wetlands, loss of habitat, loss of species through our fault, etc, are much more important, and real world, the the Goracles climate change, which looks to me to simply be a way into scaring people in order to put money in the pockets of people like the Goracle.

mark - we have been through this over and over and over again. go to school - learn some science - read the articles - then come to debate. There is no point - all you want to do is to quote things you clearly have no understanding of whatsoever because it confirms your ideological belief that science is useless (think evolution, global warming - that you refuse to acknowledge) and support more of your ideological stances that anyone who believes in these things is an idiot.
The simple fact of the matter is that nobody has 100% knowledge of anything scientific in this world - everything is a theory - supported by scientific evidence and experiment. The vast majority of the evidence points to this being a real phenomenon with a large portion being attributable due to human causes. Essentially every serious scientist - except for a fringe minority agree.

Please please please go get a basic science education and then we can debate the details

I learned a few things today:

1) I'm bent on a world socialist government
2) You can't be Christian and care about sustainable living
-or, contradictorily -
3) We have to care about the environment but it's too hard, so we should just ignore it.
4) We should not concern ourselves with the quality of life for future generations, because we should focus instead on the "here and now." (I mistakenly thought we as humans can do more than one thing at a time)

Thanks for the insights, Mark.

Mark, well said. Power Line has a good article today. It states that, while everyone speaks about the ice cap in the north pole melting, no one mentions that the ice cap in the south pole is EXPANDING and is currently at its greatest size.

You shouldn't worry so much, winnowhead. 'God' will look after everything. We can pillage and rape our environment with no adverse consequences; it must say so somewhere in the bible book. Jeremiah will know which verse to quote. Relax, go listen to some right-wing commentator; that should straighten out your thought process. You know, it really doesn't matter that much anyway, winnowhead, with the rapture just around the corner.

Avery & SInger are not the final word on global warming - there are plenty of technical rebuttals out there of their work.

Google around - it's not hard to find serious scientists who have major concerns with their focus on cycles.

And Mark, while you're at it, where do you stand on evolution? What would be the ulterior motive of scientists there?

I for one am glad there is a Hell. Good luck guys! Hopefully there is no internet connection to Heaven.

Hey, liberalT: if it is a scientific fact, then why will the disciples of global warming as caused by Man, like Al Gore, utterly refuse to debate the issue and back up their position against those who disagree? Why do they have to over-inflate what it is happening, and use hyperbole?

GWACBM is not a scientific fact. It has not even gone through the scientific method, much like Darwinism. It is not even a Theory, much less a Law.

I figure it can't be all bad, as long as the Goracle keeps jetting around in his private plane spewing bullcrap into the atmosphere and on your movie screen. Hope that Mark has 2 more 'asshats'....liberalT isn't the only one who needs a new wardrobe.

It is not even a Theory, much less a Law. - William

Exactly. It's not theory, it's only concensus, and with that I submit the following:

"Consensus is the business of politics. Science, on the contrary, requires only one investigator who happens to be right, which means that he or she has results that are verifiable by reference to the real world. In science consensus is irrelevant. What is relevant is reproducible results. The greatest scientists in history are great precisely because they broke with the consensus." - Michael Crichton

Furthermore, there are a trmendous amount of climatologists, meteriologists and other sceintists that do not buy into the concensus.

cue liberalT's defamation of Crichton and the other scientists in 3....2....1...

CO,

Have you ever heard me say that I think we should "destroy" the land at our own pleasure?

No ... I think the large timbering corporations, such as Meade Westvaco, Plumb Creek, Georgia Pacific and others are the ones who should be held accountable for raping the land ... Many Northwestern states are now sending their crews here because they are running out of sizable harvesting material, and you don't know how much I, and others have suffered mentally because of it, these beautiful hardwoods are being totally cleared from the hillsides, and it looks SICK, and not only does it look sick, but during the process of removing the timber, there are fuel and oil leaks and spills, that whenever it rains it is washed into delicate stream habitat, killing native trout, and other aquatic life there, and the wooodland wildlife species lose many homes, squirrels, turkeys, deer, migratory song birds, tree frogs, box turtles, honeybees, raccoons, opossums, ruffed grouse, and other wildlife...

My Grandad who passed away last November, at the ripe old age of 89 used to sit and tell old tales about the virgin foests that used to be here ... He said it was just open timber in them days, huge, towering oaks, and poplars, when all you had was an axe, a crosscut, and team of mighty work horses ... but that's all changed since his day and time, there is no work in it now-a-days, a guy just sits up in a huge machine called - The Harvester - works on pretty much the same principles as the excavator except it has hydraulic clamp system with a saw blade at the end of a big boom arm that is thrusted out after clamping on the tree, and the it picks the whole tree up and lays it down ... just a brute of a machine... all you have to do is work levers and push buttons ... I'd say you can cut up to 10 fifteen acres a day with it, maybe more, the pads on it are like on a dozer, and it tears the ground up everywhere it goes, and the skidder machines they make huge ruts of mud everywhere.

So, ya see, this is where we've come to, they rape the land, and bilk trillions upon trillions of dollars, and on top of that, to hunt, you have to pay a three hundred dollar fee every year, no matter if you have success hunting or not, no matter if you hunt just one day, or the whole season, while they continue to DESTROY precious habitat, DESTROY, DESTROY, DESTROY, DESTROY!!!

So, to summarize it, what do we have? Money!!! For what? Greed and Destruction, that's all it is, and that's all the Global Warming hype is about too, Greed for Power!!!

Make no mistake about it - We are just mere mortals, but when it comes right down to the end, Almighty God will have the final say, He says -'Veangance is Mine, I will repay.'

People better wake up!!!

Jeremiah

You just sounded an awful lot like an environmentalist there, Jeremiah. You haven't forsaken God for earth-worshipping, have you? Please say no... it hurts so dearly to lose a soul.

winnowhead,

No, I just think it's such a sin for man to destroy God's Creation the way he does.

It's not "sustainable/renewable" as so many would have us to believe. God has provided us with this one and only earth, and I think it is in His Will that we respect it, but not go so far as to, as you say "worship" it. The reason God gave us the oppurtunity to share in His Wonders; is so that we might want to love and serve Him, and know beyond the shadow of a doubt; that He exists.

This Earth is His, we just borrow it, so it's special, He specially made it just for us, as He made us in the image and likeness of Him!!

So, what do I think we need to do? I would like to see a cessation of [clearcutting] practices, and go to select cutting of at least 35 maybe 40 inches in diameter size limit only, and reverse the 70 year mature growth harvest limit to 200 year cycle harvests, and don't over-thin, which would help to leave more for existing wildlife to remain in stable inhabitable habitat.

We all benefit from clean air and water, as does the wildlife, which is how God Created it, and meant for it to be in the beginning, let's try and do our best to keep it that way!!!

God bless!!

Jeremiah

Jeremiah, I am not accusing you of being an "earth worshipper," as too many people like Noonan deride environmentalists as being. Your snark meter must be broken.

For what it's worth, there is a wealth of scientific research which seriously calls into question the current understanding of so-called "global warming".

Essentially every serious scientist - except for a fringe minority agree.

Another bald-faced lie by the resident retard--less than half of all climatologists/scientists are in this GW consensus. Since when is a clear majority the "fringe minority?"

Please please please go get a basic science education and then we can debate the details

Yet another outrageous statement from the resident retard, who, as evidenced by her inability to write past the second-grade level, never made it past the second grade. And we all know how much "science" one learns by the time one reaches the second grade.

libtardT, please, get professional help. You are an embarrassment to your fellow feminists, and you've completely lost this debate. Give it up.

Mark, I told you they'd go after your faith...

"While the Antarctic Peninsula area has warmed in recent years and ice near it diminished during the Southern Hemisphere summer, the interior of Antarctica has been colder and ice elsewhere has been more extensive and longer lasting, which explains the increase in total extent. This dichotomy was shown in this World Climate Report blog posted recently with a similar tale told in this paper by Ohio State Researcher David Bromwich, who agreed “It’s hard to see a global warming signal from the mainland of Antarctica right now”."

Your right 1H8L1BS...liberaltard telling someone else to get an education is laughable...he's the poster boy for the quote "better to be thought a moron than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"...lol

Zoot,

libtardT is the poster child for LA--Lobotomies Anonymous...

Your right 1H8L1BS...

Posted by: ZootAllure at September 16, 2007 12:56 AM

Keefer, are you not going to educate the Zoot on the proper use of 'your' vs 'you're'? After deriding liberalT, don't you think it rather ironic that he would make such a glaring grammatical error himself? I guess he wasn't paying attention during your English tutorial, keefer. LOL!!

Keefer, are you not going to educate the Zoot on the proper use of 'your' vs 'you're'? After deriding liberalT, don't you think it rather ironic that he would make such a glaring grammatical error himself? I guess he wasn't paying attention during your English tutorial, keefer. LOL!!

Once again, I have to be redundant, due to the short attention span of the loony left. Here goes, and sorry to all of you who haven't toasted all their brain cells with mind-altering chemicals:

We on the right are, according to all you academic elites on the left, "knuckle-dragging rubes who barely made it out of high school," so we are stupid. We all drive around in our pickup trucks, with a shotgun mounted in the rear window, chawin' on a plug of Red Man, a-lookin' for the nearest hoe-down. We are uneducated, so we don't know how to write. So why should I correct those who know no better?

Also, as I've stated before, I am biased, and I don't "eat my own." Many of my allies here commit the same writing errors as the troll pukes constantly do here, and even I am not perfect. But they are my friends, and we are on the same page politically, so I will not correct their mistakes.

Why don't you correct them for us, CO? It'll be your only valid contribution to B4B in the years you've been trolling here, polluting an otherwise fine blog. And don't assert that you have better things to do, because if you did, you wouldn't waste your time, as you have, posting here.

CO, yes at 1am I made a slight grammatical error. I had been out with some friends burning some dinosaurs in my 454 SS Chevelle. Just doing my part to stave off Global Cooling.

How about instead of being the mind numbingly dense, vapid, vacuous, inane, unimaginative, insipid, tedious, tiresome, asinine, imbecilic, fatuous, foolish, and idiotic c**t that you usually are, try and contribute something to the discussion.

How about instead of being the mind numbingly dense, vapid, vacuous, inane, unimaginative, insipid, tedious, tiresome, asinine, imbecilic, fatuous, foolish, and idiotic c**t that you usually are, try and contribute something to the discussion.

Zoot, that would require some brain cells. CO has none; while you were out "burning dinosaurs," he was out burning a "fifty rock."

btw, what is "burning dinosaurs?"

Never mind, I get it--burning fossil fuel. Duh! And way to go; I'm getting ready to jump on my gas-guzzlin', air-pollutin,' out-of-tune lawn tractor.

Have a good day, folks--see ya tonite...

Harvester/John Deere 653G.

This machine is for production on a mass scale ... I call it - 'The Wood Hog.'

Jeremiah

Once the trees are cut and ready for hauling, here's how it's done, with this machine -The Skidder.

I'll be right back, I'll go get the picture for the log loader/cherry picker...

Jeremiah

Once the logs are ready to be loaded and transported to the chipper (paper) mill or saw (Lumber) mill ... this is the machine that does that part of the process ... and next comes the tractor and trailor, which takes them to the mill... hold your horses, I'll be right back....

Jeremiah

Hauling logs! from the landing!

Jeremiah

Wait... If it has been happening for the last million years wouldn't that mean that young earth creationism has to be wrong?

As right wingers you can't spout off "scientific" evidence for your claim while simultaneously insisting that science is a liberal conspiracy.

Science is a liberal conspiracy?

WTF? Michael you dipstick, who in the hell has said that on this blog?

Man you guys are so stuck on stupid it is painful.

Singer is a well known global warming denier of long
standing. He is at odds with the world scientific
community. In plain English he is full of shit.

It is worth remembering that even National Review has acknowledged that global warming is taking place, and this after years of scoffing at it.

It is also worth remembering that George Bush, who
you claim to support, has acknowledged that global
warming is taking place. Are you calling him a
liar?

After 99 percent of the world's climate scientists
have reached a conclusion you can take it to be
true. Guys like you react to the truth like Count
Dracula reacts to the cross. Tell me, do you think the United States faked the Moon lanings?