Copy-cat Dan, following in Imus' footsteps. Well, Imus had a case, and a reason to sue. Blather probably doesn't, but they'll probably settle out-of-court, just to make the bufoon go away.

Pia Pium

This brings back some fond memories. It was RatherGate that really got me interested in political blogs. I had discovered blogs early that year (2004), but hadn't commented anywhere until the CBS/TANG story blew up. I was in the Navy Reserve at the same time George Bush was in the TANG, and I also sold Olympia typewriters (the kind Bush's commander's secretary used) in my civilian job. It was hysterical to see the lengths the people who wanted the story to be true went to to defend it. It was truly BDS in full bloom.

more manufactured outrage from those that worship a network that pulls these kind of stunts daily. of course, i suppose i should hold an opinion news network to a lower standard.

Relying on the Fox News Channel as your only source of news is like using MAD Magazine as a legitimate source of news. - Ron Kaufman

In an April study conducted by the PEW Research Center, it was found that Fox News watchers rank nearly DEAD LAST in knowledge of national and international affairs. Handy chart here:

http://people-press.org/reports/images/319-2.gif

no wonder you're stuck attacking an esteemed former anchor with decades of award-winning reporting experience and a scary little moveon.org ad - no one really takes you guys seriously.

conscriptor, we're not "stuck" attacking Dan Rather because of any problems with Fox News. We just don't think that someone who bases a story on forged documents, and then insists that the "thrust" of his story is true anyway, has very much credibility.

In an April study conducted by the PEW Research Center, it was found that Fox News watchers rank nearly DEAD LAST in knowledge of national and international affairs. Handy chart here:

Pretty funny (in a sad, pathetic sort of way), Conscriptor. The figures for Fox matched almost exactly the national average, while The Daily Show/Colbert Report finished first. I know several people (my oldest daughter and son-in-law among them) who get a good chunk of their news from the Daily Show. Their view of current events is nearly as warped as yours.

Way, way, way off topic, but I can't resist. I found the following on the lefty blog site:

DING DONG, THE WITCH IS DEAD!....TimesSelect is no more. Krugman, Dowd, and Friedman are once again available to the masses. To celebrate, let's take a look at Bob Herbert's Tuesday column:

Now what this is in reality is a failed liberal capitalist enterprise. TimesSelect, a pay for liberal columns website, went under because no one would pay to read the garbage. Yet this site is "celebrating" that fact.

Isn't that great?

I find it interesting that Retired Spook compares his service in the Navy Reserve to that of George Bush. Did your dad get you in a cushy position to avoid Vietnam? Did you opt out of your commitment to do something else so you wouldn't be called up? Did you have a job that assured you would not go to Vietnam? Apparently you were working selling typwriters to supplement your income. Want to venture as to what Bush was doing in his spare time?

Ih8everyone - I know - it is typEwriter - phat fingers.

OK. So forging government documents is a felony. lets start REALLY checking into where those documents came from.

Oh and Sunny, flying the most crashed and most dangerous aircraft the Air Force ever flew was a cushy assignment? On what planet?

Sunny, I knew someone would come along and post a comment like yours. I'm not sure whether you're ignorant, stupid or both. I'll give you the benefit of a doubt and assume you're probably just not old enough to remember the early 70's.

Do you have some inside information that Bush's dad got him the position in the TANG? George H. W. Bush was just an obscure Texas Congressman at the time, and there wasn't exactly a surplus of people scrambling to fly F-102's. I think it's pretty accurate to say that the majority of men who joined the reserves or national guard during the mid to late 60's did so to avoid being drafted, but they served -- they didn't flee to Canada.

Did you know that George Bush volunteered to go to Vietnam? Did you know that the F-102, the plane he flew, was not only difficult and dangerous to fly, but was being phased out of the AF inventory at the time his TANG service was winding down? Did you know that, in the early 70's, when the Vietnam War was also winding down, that Reserve and Guard units were kicking marginal performers out and generally not pursuing people who weren't showing up, especially pilots whose planes were being retired. As I said, I was in the Navy Reserve at that time. We only went after those individuals whose whereabouts we knew and gave them the opportunity to report to the reserve center for how ever long it took to fulfill their obligation. We had one guy that had a year left at the time he quit coming, and he reported to the reserve center for 2 straight weeks and got his discharge. My understanding is that that's basically what George Bush did. If you have some credible information that he did not fulfill his obligation, let's hear it.

Oh, and selling typewriters was my primary job at the time. I stayed in the Reserves after active duty to "supplement my income", and because I loved what we did. The questions you asked in your post indicate that you really don't have a clue.

Spook,
Don't forget to mention that when George Bush enlisted, the F-102 was in service in Viet Nam. to pick this assignment with the idea of avoiding Viet Nam defies logic.

Good point, Bane.

Here's a good piece about the plane that George Bush flew.

Now, doing some very preliminary calculations, total US deaths in Vietnam were of the order of 50,000 out of a total of 2.6 million who served, or roughly 2%. OK, how many pilots were trained to fly the F-102? 875 planes entered service, and from other figures in the same article we can see it was two years of training and three years of flying for a five year enlistment period (that's assuming that everyone did the minimum Air National Guard sign up, not career military. No draftees were ever taught to fly.). OK, and the plane was around from 1956 to 1974. OK, that's an 18 year period and three years active service each pilot gives us 5,250 pilots trained on that bird. (This is a very rough figure. Very rough indeed. Anyone who wants to help please do so. I'm assuming only one pilot per bird at a time, which may or may not be true. I'm also assuming all birds in service for the entire span which is absurdly untrue, but one will underestimate the number of pilots, the other will overestimate. If anyone actually knows the exact number trained to fly the F-102 let me know and I can change the calculation.)

So, 5,250 pilots and 70 deaths means a death rate of: 1.3%.

Jeez. The lousy damn coward. He went and hid in a unit, one which had active service members actually in Vietnam, one where the death rate in training and peacetime from accident alone was damn nearly the same as active service in Vietnam for all troops. Sheesh.

Retired Spook, I am neither dumb nor ignorant. However, unlike you, I will not stoop to insulting you with such name calling. And we are probably about the same age, as it was my generation of young men who served in Vietnam. I lost family members and class mates to that war.

"Did you know that George Bush volunteered to go to Vietnam? "

Please provide proof.

"Did you know that the F-102, the plane he flew, was not only difficult and dangerous to fly, . . "

Not at dangerous as going to Vietnam.

"Did you know that, in the early 70's, when the Vietnam War was also winding down, that Reserve and Guard units were kicking marginal performers out and generally not pursuing people who weren't showing up, especially pilots whose planes were being retired. "

Well, we may agree on this statement. From what I have read, George Bush was indeed a marginal performer, and did not show up. However, I have not found that his plane was retired at the time he failed to show up. How on earth do you defend this behavior? Just because it was George Bush who failed to complete his obligation to the military?

"George H. W. Bush was just an obscure Texas Congressman at the time, . . "

George H. W. Bush has NEVER been an obscure anything, let alone an obscure Texas Congressman, and certainly was powerful enough to get his son in the Guard. It is well documented that George H. W. pulled strings to get George Jr. put at the top of the list to get into the guard. So, Spook, you will have to do better than that. I have always thought your comments were well thought out and researched, with a lot of common sense. However, this is one time I agree with very little you have written. I am always amazed by those who defend George Bush's military service, but vilify John Kerry, who served two tours in Vietnam. I am guessong it is because John Kerry is a Democrat and Bush is a Republican. Be honest!

Spook-

Wasn't the father of the little known Congressman George H.W. Bush Senator Prescott Bush? Also, isn't there some record out there of 43 saying he was so glad to get in to TANG (I love the drink by the way) because he was considering blowing out his ear drum with a shotgun blast? I am sure he said this in jest but if he wasn't Prescott's grandson he probably wouldn't hav been in TANG.

sunny, well actually the F-102 was as dangerous to fly out of combat as in. jeeezzz, I am so sick of addressing these same old lies over and over.

OK -
JFK was sleeping with an East German spy
LBJ's wife owned Bell Helicopter during Viet Nam and they made millions off the war
Teddy Kennedy's father was dismissed as ambassador to England because he tried to extort exclusive rights to import whiskey to the USA in exchange for support against the Nazi's
Nancy Pelosi pushed exemptions as part of the minimum wage bill that would benefit her husbands company.
Previous SOTH Jim Wright put earmarks into bills to benefit a hotel and bar he owned in Fort Worth
Teddy K severely restricted ALL windmill projects in the nation to kill the Cape Cod windmill project.
Jim Webb regularly flaunts DC gun laws and refused to stand up for his aid when caught with one of his guns.
Janet Reno under Bill Clinton used tanks to burn American men, women and yes CHILDREN to death at Waco.
The FBI under Clinton was ordered to shoot an American citizen (Randy Weaver) despite him posing no threat. They missed and murdered his wife - who had NO warrants against her.

More?

We should investigate the FELONY creation of forged government documents used in the story. There is an actual crime here. Rather and others at CBS should be asked under oath to explain where these documents came from and that chain should be followed back to the left wing hatemeisters who created them.

There is an actual crime at the heart of this scandal. And, libel and slander laws would apply if there was malice. Personally, I think malice against George Bush would be one of the easiest things to prove ever.

So, Spook, you will have to do better than that. I have always thought your comments were well thought out and researched, with a lot of common sense.

Unlike virtually all of your comments, which are not well thought out, not only not well researched but not researched at all, and contain no common sense.

However, this is one time I agree with very little you have written.

I have yet to read ANYTHING you've written that I agree with.

Sunny,
Claiming it’s “well documented” is not the same as documenting it.
“ George H. W. pulled strings to get George Jr. put at the top of the list to get into the guard” Not according to the Colonel that swore him in. Additionally strings weren’t needed to be pulled;

"Most applicants were applying for ANG enlisted positions not for pilot training. The highest number of pilot applicants that the Texas ANG Group had (at any one time) during the Vietnam War was around ten. The reason for this very low number was there were stringent educational, security clearance and physical requirements that had to be met for pilot training in the ANG; also, there was a high “danger factor” in flying the F-102 aircraft. For every ten pilot applicants, usually only two were selected by the ANG to attend USAF pilot training school."

"failed to complete his obligation to the military"
Air National Guard Service Period
TANG Points Earned by Lt. Bush
Dates; points needed; Points Earned
May-68 to May-69 50 253
May-69 to May-70 50 340
May-70 to May-71 50 137
May-71 to May-72 50 112
May-72 to May-73 50 56
Jun -73 to Jul-73 50 56
Ref:
http://www.hillnews.com/york/090904.aspx
Points needed; 300
Points earned by Bush: 954

“ at the time he failed to show up” Witnesses place him in Alabama during the time in question. And, he was honorably discharged; as opposed to Kerry who received his discharge by fiat years after being tossed out.

"Avoid Vietnam" Wrong again, [ by 1972] the 147th Fighter Wing was also beginning to phase out the F-102 in the air defense role in favor of F-101B and F-101F two-seat long-range interceptors.

Fred Bradley, a friend of Bush's who was also serving in the Texas ANG, reported that he and Bush inquired about participating in the Palace Alert program. However, the two were told by a superior, MAJ Maurice Udell, that they were not yet qualified since they were still in training and did not have the 500 hours of flight experience required. Furthermore, ANG veteran COL William Campenni, who was a fellow pilot in the 111th FIS at the time, told the Washington Times that Palace Alert was winding down and not accepting new applicants.

Thanks Bane. But Sunny won't care. Why learn facts when hate and ignorance fill the void so nicely?

Spook states: " Did you know that, in the early 70's, when the Vietnam War was also winding down, that Reserve and Guard units were kicking marginal performers . . .

From the Washington Post, 7/28/1999
"It was May 27, 1968, at the height of the Vietnam War. Bush was 12 days away from losing his student deferment from the draft at a time when Americans were dying in combat at the rate of 350 a week. The unit Bush wanted to join offered him the chance to fulfill his military commitment at a base in Texas. It was seen as an escape route from Vietnam by many men his age, and usually had a long waiting list.

Bush had scored only 25 percent on a "pilot aptitude" test, the lowest acceptable grade. But his father was then a congressman from Houston, and the commanders of the Texas Guard clearly had an appreciation of politics.

That commitment, in turn, was to frame a period of aimlessness and drift that Bush now calls his "nomadic" years: As the war and the youth culture of the 1960s rocked America, Bush partied and dated with gusto, dabbled half-heartedly in business and politics, and flew jets part time. Apart from his Guard commitment, he was unemployed for stretches that lasted for months. His last job before he returned to the East to attend Harvard Business School, as a social worker helping poor children, was arranged by his father after George W. drunkenly confronted him one night and challenged him to a fight."

Spook , the solders were dying at the rate of 350 a week - and you call that "winding down"? Is that the same as Cheney's "last throes"? I remember watching the body bags come off the airplanes on the evening news every night. If the draft was reinstated, you would see a much different attitude from those who do not send their sons and daughters to fight this good fight i.e. Mitt Romney- those who staunchly support this "war on terror". You disagree?

Why oh why is George W. Bush (the greatest President in American history) 'hat tip to james allegro', so misunderstood?

Has he not, from the momentous day he was 'elected', served his nation with honor and distinction? Has he not brought integrity and brilliant intellect back into the Oval Office and restored people's faith in the capability of the Federal Government to expertly manage the country? Has he not made the United States of America the most respected and beloved country in the world?

I guess you're right, Kahn. Easier to believe the editorial from Wa-Po ("It was seen as an escape route from Vietnam by many men his age, and usually had a long waiting list" and this affects Bush how?; "commanders of the Texas Guard clearly had an appreciation of politics" Regardless of evidence to the contrary) than accept the facts.

Spook , the solders were dying at the rate of 350 a week - and you call that "winding down"?

Come on, Sunny, you're comparing 1968 with 1973. If you can't keep up, take notes. And, as Bane notes, that WAPO oped is just chock full of well researched facts. (sarcasm off) Ya know, I'm seldom into calling people names, but you really are a frickin' idiot.

BTW, sunny, while George Bush was blowing off his last year of service in the TANG and then performing a bunch of make-up drills to fulfill his obligation, John Kerry, still a commissioned officer in the Navy Reserve, was meeting secretly in Paris with our ENEMY. In all honesty, tell us which you think is worse.

Come on Spook, you are the one not keeping up. You assert that it was in the early 1970 that the war was winding down. Didn't end until April 1973, so I guess the question is, how early is early? Where was Bush at that time? Sitting in some bar is my guess. Even in the early 1970s thousands of lives were lost. You have gotten kind of prickly about this issue, so I am guessing I have hit a nerve.

"Ya know, I'm seldom into calling people names, but you really are a frickin' idiot."

Oh really??? You seldom call names? You could have fooled me. I do not know what makes you think you have the intellectual authority to call anyone else a "frickin idiot". I will be happy to put up my educational background and work experience against yours. And yet, I still do not call you names. You are becoming more and more childish in your name calling.

Just one more statistic from the Vietnam War to ponder:

National Guard: 6,140 served; 101 died.

Retired Spook obviously wasn't alive in 1970 when he says the Vietnam War was winding down (in 1972 they were still issuing draft cards and I got one), but that only shows the level of ineptitude and false information that he and his "spook" cohorts are famous for. No wonder we have bin Laden and all you can focus on is OJ Simpson and Dan Rather. Putzes, every little collaborator/creampuff in here.

jenna and sunny,
"in the early 70's, when the Vietnam War was also winding down, What a pair of Aces you two are.

Oh, and btw, no draft orders were issued in 1972.

Inept? No, you're just another ill-informed partisan hack with BDS.

Controversy 1 is that President Bush had help with political influence when he joined the guard in 1968. Yes. '68 was the hight of the war. CBS ran forged documents to "prove" that this was so. The documents were debunked and the National Guard officers still alive say Bush did not get special treatment. He was after all a Yale and Harvard grad.

Controversy 2 is that Bush skipped out on service. This has also been debunked (see the numbers above). This would have been in '73, near the end of President Bush's commitment.

Sonny and Jenna, you understand linear time concepts, right? The fact that one year comes before the next? President Bush did volunteer for service in Viet Nam as a guardsman. By that time he did not have enough hours and his plane was being phased out. It did not make sense to retrain him on a new plane with such a short time left on his commitment.

You people really are stupid. Revel in it.

1968; Yale grad, hadn't attended Harvard yet. Sorry, Kahn, just keeping the record on the up-and-up.

Where's Almiranta when we need her? She had, quite possibly the definitive answer to these BDS pukes on the subject of TANG and Lt. Bush. Remember?

I, for one miss her.

Didn't end until April 1973, so I guess the question is, how early is early?

Sunny, from my earlier comment:

Did you know that, in the early 70's, when the Vietnam War was also winding down (emphasis added)

Now, if the Vietnam War ended in 1973, then it was winding down in the "early 70's"

Where was Bush at that time? Sitting in some bar is my guess.

Your guess? YOUR GUESS? Your guess is worth about as much as a bucket of warm spit. Even if it were true, it's still better than collaborating with the enemy.

You are becoming more and more childish in your name calling.

Ya know, sunny, I'm just crushed that you're so offended. I thought calling you a frickin' idiot was pretty mild compared to what I really think of you, and it has nothing to do with your age or level of education. Your whole attitude is offensive to me, so I guess we're even.

Meanwhile - CBS, a "trusted" "mainstream" news outlet ran a smear story against the President weeks before the election with forged documents. Faking these documents was in fact, a felony.

I'd like to know who did it.

Hard to believe Dan Blather would poke himself in an open wound ... again!

Does he really want his greatest disgrace (among so many) to be fodder for public discourse? And, once in a Court of Law, the perpetrator of the fraud would be exposed with no immunity from prosecution for deliberately forging government (military) records. CBS won’t be able to protect his sorry arse once the lawyers start the tug-o’-war.

btw, my nephew, who turned 18 last year, received his "draft card" in the mail; I guess that means we’re not “winding down” in Vietnam, yet!.

I'd like to know who did it.

Kahn, probably the same person who put the long-missing (and subpoened) Rose Law Firm billing records on the table in the library of the Clintons' WH residence.

Yahoodi?????
VRWC?????
Neocons?????
Gingrich?????
Ken Starr?????
Craig Livingstone?????
Billy Dale?????
My head hurts!

Did your dad get you in a cushy position to avoid Vietnam?

MoveOn talking point--a lie that grandma sunny swallowed hook, line, and sinker.

Did you opt out of your commitment to do something else so you wouldn't be called up?

Another MoveOn talking point--a lie that this old bag swallowed hook, line, and sinker.

Did you have a job that assured you would not go to Vietnam?

Yet another MoveOn talking point--a lie that grandma biddy swallowed hook, line, and sinker.

That makes three. Congrats, you senile old bat; you just won the Triple Crown!!!

Thanks Bane. But Sunny won't care. Why learn facts when hate and ignorance fill the void so nicely?

Exactly, Kahn, and notice that the old gal hasn't responded to Bane's post at all, but she keeps citing such "objective" sources as the WaPo. She's a typical Donkaroach--turn on the lights, and they scatter.

Oh, and btw, no draft orders were issued in 1972.

Yeah, jenny-o; you weren't threatened with the draft. You just had to register, as did I, in 1974. Biiiig deal.

It is well documented that George H. W. pulled strings to get George Jr. put at the top of the list to get into the guard.

Yeah, well documented--in the WaPo, The Nation, The Guardian(UK), DailyKooks, and DU.

You're off your rocker, granny sunny, and you're a freakin' idiot.

Give me a shout-out the next time you call Washington Journal--C-Span--calling for Bush's impeachment.

Spook, Bane, navydad, neocon, note how this thread is about Dan Blather, but all the troll pukes have made it about President Bush?

Well, since it's now about President Bush, I'm jealous of my neighbor, a Navy Chief who works at NSA. Well, Bush was there yesterday, and my neighbor, who we'll call Tom, met Bush, VP Cheney, Stephen Hadley, and a bunch of other administration officials. News flash for you trolls: President Bush was well-informed about Tom's section's mission, and he asked a lot of questions about this and that, which Tom couldn't reveal to me due to their highly-classified nature.

Anyway, the President isn't the big dope you all think he is, but you already know that. Your hatred of the man has clouded your minds. Well, that, and all those chemicals you ingest.

Has he not, from the momentous day he was 'elected', served his nation with honor and distinction? Has he not brought integrity and brilliant intellect back into the Oval Office and restored people's faith in the capability of the Federal Government to expertly manage the country? Has he not made the United States of America the most respected and beloved country in the world?

Sorry, CO; did you say something? No? Oh well, I thought you did. Sorry...

Oh godly one, he should know what Tom's mission is he is the frickin President who gets daily briefings on what is going on! Even a parrot can regurgitate words spoken to them over and over.

Nugent Rocks, wang dang sweet poon tang!

Even a parrot can regurgitate words spoken to them over and over."

One need only read your posts for proof of that.

Pia Zadora,
Sorry, I couldn't resist.
I recently received as a gift from a good friend (a liberal) a pair of White House Cufflinks that I can't wait to wear. I haven't had occasion to dress up that much this summer, but soon ... so soon! Imagine the looks on the faces of my academician colleagues when I show off my 'links from the Bush White House!

Think these "perfessors" will be jealous? (or should I keep the engine running for a quick getaway?)"

Keefer, you can run, but you can't hide (behind a new name, that is). Glad to see you finally figured out how to change it from that 2-line monstrosity, but Pia? PIA? What the hell's wrong with "keefer"?

Bane-

I wasn' the one quoting freerepublic. A cornerstone of balanced journalism. Now go drink your exspensive scotch and smoke your fabulous stogies.

Uh, sleepy,

“Quoting” is acceptable debate, aping your tiresome Dailykos talking points isn’t. Here’s an example:

"This non-binding, we are sorry Gen. Petreaus move on.org is so bad, resolution is so democrat I can't believe you guys eat this shit up."

So many lefty parrots, so little sagacity.

It's CRACKERS to slip a roze on the dropsy in the snide! CRACKERS, I tells ya', CRACKERS!
sleepyjeans

So many lefty parrots, so little sagacity.

I'd say that sums up this thread pretty succincly.

Back to the topic, it seems to me that Rather's suit is based upon the premise that he was trading on his name on the Bush story without putting in the time and got pinched. So basically it boils down to whether he deserved to be overpaid then or deserves to be overpaid now. My guess is neither.

By the way, what's wrong with a taste for expensive scotch? And what does it imply about the worth of one's opinion either way?

I spelled "succinctly" wrong.

TANG

February 1968:
Bush takes an Air Force officers test. Scores in 25th percentile in the pilot
aptitude portion. Declares that he does not wish to serve overseas.

May 27, 1968:
Bush enlists in Texas Air National Guard. Aided by Texas House Speaker Ben Barnes, he jumps over waiting list. He pledges two years of active duty and four years of reserve duty.

June 9, 1968:
Bush's student deferment expires.

September 1968:
After basic training, Bush pulls inactive duty to act as gopher on Florida Senator Edward J. Gurney's campaign

November 1969:
Bush is flown to the White House by President Nixon for a date with daughter Tricia.

June 1970: Joins the Guard's "Champagne Unit," where he flies with sons of Texas' elite.

November 7, 1970:
Promoted to first lieutenant. Rejected by University of Texas School of Law.

January 1971:
The Guard begins testing for drugs during physicals.

May 26, 1972:
Transfers to Alabama Guard unit so he can work on Senator William Blount's reelection campaign. According to his commanding officer, Bush never shows up for duty while in Alabama, nor can anyone confirm he ever serves in the Guard again.

August 1972:
Bush is grounded for missing a mandatory physical.

November 1972:
Bush returns to Houston, but never reports for Guard duty.

October 1, 1973:
The Air National Guard relieves Bush from commitment eight months early, allowing him to attend Harvard Business School.

Spook, it's Latin.

mack55IQ, where'd ya get all that?

And were you aware that many people are released from reserve/guard units early, to pursue other endeavors? Even during wars, dipsh*t, and without any favoritism. You just parroted talking points, some of which were probably on Blather's forged memo.

While you're at it, can you explain why your hero, Spitball Kerry, didn't get his honorable discharge until 1978--years after he left the Navy? I mean, you being a former "Marine," and an "expert" on military matters.

Bwahahahahahahahaha!!! Lard-ass, Markookie, and mack55IQ--the Three Stooges...bwahahahahaha!!!

Bane-

I don't know what you just said earlier about crackers whatever.... maybe it is beyond me or maybe before my time.... I don't know. But to say that I am parroting Daily Kos or DU (a site I have never been to) is wrong. Though I do check out DK I find them to militant and crazy for my liberal taste. But that anti-move-on measure is so lame. It is what Reid would do. I wish my party had balls and made the Republicans actually fillabuster the Webb Amendment. They are just such pussies and it is frustrating. Even when the population so overwhelmingly wants us out of Iraq they just back down.

Anyhow, Bane I assume what you typed earlier is from something. What and Where? It seems like something from the muppets.

Rico,
From what I’ve gathered you hit it on the head; Blather blames CBS for his (Blather’s) failure to vet the story. He stubbornly holds to the “fake but accurate” storyline and now claims that he apologized but didn’t mean it. Sounds like "liberal logic" to me.

And thanks to Mack for laying out the timeline that delusional Dan believes actually happened. I’d forgotten how absurd it was.

Hey, Mack, do you suppose anyone with an IQ above a centipede believes that? I can’t imagine anyone that gullible could hold down a job. Birdies eat the breadcrumbs and they’re stuck at work all night.

Gene, go back to sleep; you're annoying me.

pia pium : honest, godly, holy, pious, dutiful, patriotic.

Yeah, I guess I'm OK with that. Where do you come up with this sh*t?

They are just such pussies and it is frustrating.

Cheer up Sleepygene (I know it's already been done -- it's still funny), that's one of the few Lib comments I've seen on this blog that I agree with 100%.

Rico-
There is nothing wrong with having a taste for nice things. It was just my immature thought tossed in. Bane clearly is smarter than I and most of the posters on this site, and he knows it, and sometimes he talks about his booming portfolio, drinking exspensive scotch etc. and it comes across as arrogance to me. It is not him it is me. I do enjoy reading his and your posts. Oh well back to my diet coke and marlboros.

Pia,
I can't get used to calling you that, he got that list from the fever swamp Truth and Politics . org

Marching orders all around.

Bane,

Now that's a highly accurate site. They only missed W's DOB by 3 years.

Oh well back to my diet coke and marlboros.

Sleepy, how do you feel about Pelosi and her pals wanting to jack up the tax on your Marlboros to pay for health insurance for children of parents making up to $80,000 a year? Now there's a plan.

Spook,
Details? Details? We don' need no stinkin' Details! We don' gotta show you no Details!

Thanks Mountain.

I don't know the details of the plan, but isn't it a family with four children making $83,000? That is not a rich family as Rush would have you believe. I don't have kids, but $83K to raise four seems like it would be a tight budget. I have no problem with sin taxes. If it gets too much maybe it will make me quit.

sleepygene: Bane clearly is smarter than I and most of the posters on this site, and he knows it,

If it's that clear (and it is), then chances are he knows it (and he does). Cuz he's smart.

and sometimes he talks about his booming portfolio, drinking exspensive scotch etc. and it comes across as arrogance to me.

Or maybe he doesn't suffer fools very well. Either way, I'm pretty sure acting immaturely is not the way to distinguish between the two. Personally, I think Bane has a right to a certain level of arrogance. And if you approach him right you might actually learn something.

"Oh well back to my diet coke and marlboros"

Looks like we agree on something.

I don't get how discussing the finer things in life a person enjoys, which may come across to others as boostful, means that that particular indivdual doesn't suffer fools well. And because someone may not have the most intellectually orignal ideas on things does not necessarily mean they are a fool.

orignal ideas

Sleepygene,

The [Origin] says it all, and if it originates from the dailykooks? It's poison, and should be discarded of.

Jeremiah

How friggin dare anyone out there make fun of Bush after all he has been through.
He lost his brain, he choked on a pretzel. He had two friggin kids.
His AG turned out to be a looser, a cheater, and now he’s loosing a war. All you people care about is….. Readers and making money off of him.
HE’S A HUMAN! What you don’t realize is that Bush is making you all this money and all you do is write a bunch of crap about him.
He hasn’t performed on stage in years. His song is called “give me more” for a reason because all you people want is MORE MORE MORE MORE MORE.

LEAVE HIM ALONE! You are lucky he even performed for you BASTARDS!
LEEEAVE BUUUUUUSSSSH ALLLLLONE!…..Please.
Perez Hilton talked about professionalism and said if Bush was a professional he would’ve pulled it off no matter what.
Speaking of professionalism, when is it professional to publicly bash someone who is going through a hard time?
Leave Bush Alone Please…. Leave George Bush alone…right now….I mean it.
Anyone that has a problem with him you deal with me, because he is not well right now.
Leave him alone

sleepygene: I don't get how discussing the finer things in life a person enjoys, which may come across to others as boostful [sic], means that that particular indivdual doesn't suffer fools well.

It doesn't necessarily. But I suspect there may be more involved in this case.

And because someone may not have the most intellectually orignal ideas on things does not necessarily mean they are a fool.

It doesn't necessarily. But I suspect there may be more involved in this case.

Put them all together and what do you have? You see, my studied opinion is that some leftie talking points and some rightie talking points have at least a kernel of truth to them. And the way to a substantive discussion is to try to knock them off those talking points and to try to provoke them to think deeper. I don't expect anyone to agree with me -- if for no other reason than most of the time I have more questions than answers. But sometimes the answers they present are obviously insufficient. In those cases (especially if I know them to a certain extent), I don't mind getting in their face a bit. I try very hard to be cordial, and stick to the argument, but sometimes it gets really hard. Like Bane I've been accused of being full of myself too. Occasionally I even deserve it, because there are times when I bring more pre-formed opinions than evidence to the argument. But there are also plenty of times when it's exceedingly obvious that that is more true of others than me. And to the extent that that's obvious I do admit to getting "impatient" because, quite frankly, there's a limit beyond which I can suffer fools no longer. But still, I try to be diplomatic about it: I'm not above subtle sarcasm. After that I just ignore them. That might not be entertaining to those who like screamers, but I don't like screaming.

I guess that means we’re not “winding down” in Vietnam, yet!.

ROFLMAO, DL! Excellent!

Spook, just call me "a patriot." I think I got it from Patriot Post, an email I get. They do a lot of Latin, of which I know very little about.

he choked on a pretzel. He had two friggin kids.

Uh, I believe it was "dad" who choked on the pretzel, you brain-dead ex-"Marine." I left out the "He lost his brain" part of your post, because obviously, you were writing in the third-person at the time.

His AG turned out to be a looser, a cheater, and now he’s loosing a war.

The only loser is the moron who doesn't know how to spell "loser" and "losing."

Which Stooge are you, mack5.5IQ? May I call you "Shemp?"

Naw, never mind; why insult Shemp?

Pia Pium [oh man, did I have that interpreted wrong: you wrote "Pium" and I saw "Plum". I don't see so good, lol!]: Which Stooge are you, mack5.5IQ? May I call you "Shemp?"

My guess is that "mack55" added a "k" and a digit. In other words, it's a play on "mac54", which was Tom Foley's nic.

Well, we'll see what happens when the hands go up and the stuff you say can get you in trouble. Rather's case seems to be that he wasn't all that involved and the story was accurate and the documents weren't forged. Fair enough.

I'm glad he filed this law suit, The felonies were never investigated and the active anti-Bush motivation of CBS will be exposed under oath and on the record. I wish that someone would file slander/libel lawsuits against both Rather and CBS.

By the way, thats how President Clinton got into trouble. He attacked anyone that had the courage to say he'd sexually harassed them and finally someone filed a law suit against him. That led to him lying under oath. Um, he later lost the Civil case also. Proving that by a preponderance of the evidence, he was guilty of workplace sexual harassment.

Lets get it into court! I'm looking forward to it.

My guess is that "mack55" added a "k" and a digit. In other words, it's a play on "mac54", which was Tom Foley's nic.

So, mack5.5IQ is Tom Foley, back to wreak havoc on the GOP, because they "threw him under the bus?" Hmmm, that explains why he hates women.

btw, what does "nic" stand for? I told you I'm computer-illiterate...

Pia,

Who is Tom Foley? Oh I remember, isn’t he the Republican Senator from Florida that has prostitutes change his diaper? No wait that is Republican Senator David Vitter.
Well then who the heck is Tom Foley? Now I remember, Tom Foley is the guy that was arrested in the Minneapolis, MN airport bathroom for trying to get busy with an undercover cop. No wait that was Republican Senator Larry Craig from Idaho.
Tom Foley? Tom Foley? Sorry it’s not ringing any bells…
Maybe you meant Republican Congressman Mark Foley from Florida? No, there’s no way that you would be stupid enough to dredge up the name of a Gay Republican pedophile for all to read. To remind everyone of Mark Foley would just be plain dumb.
I give up. Who’s Tom Foley?

pedophile? 18 year olds? I hope not. Good of you to gay bash. The party of hypocrisy, thats you.

nic - Network Interface Card

Mack,

That whole sarcasm thing isn’t really working for you is it?

Let me help you here, stick to monosyllabic outbursts of churlish heckling and leave the cerebral stuff to those that have more than just a brainstem; I don’t want to see you hurt yourself.

Tom Foley... Oops! I meant Mark Foley. Tom Foley played infield, mostly for the Expos. My apologies to Tom Foley.

keef, I meant "nic" as short for nickname.

I thought Tom Foley was a former Dem Speaker of the House. Did he play baseball before or after he was speaker?

Rico,
Weren’t you talking about Tom Foley (D) the disgraced former Speaker of the House involved in the House Banking Scandal and Post Office Scandal who replaced Jim Wright (D) the disgraced former Speaker of the House forced from office by the House ethics committee for taking dirty money from phony sales of a non-existent book, and putting speaking fees in his wife’s name to avoid income limits, who replaced the drunkard Tip O’Niell (D) who took over after disgraced former Speaker of the House Carl Albert (D) who accepted bribes in the Tongsun Park Scandal?

That Tom foley?

” Where's Almiranta… I, for one miss her.”

Bane,
As do I. But thankfully we still have wonderful hosts along with a number of users like you, Kahn, Spook, keefer, A-10, Bigfoot, Freedom1, neocon, navydad, SEW, jbiccum, AAR and many other who are incredibly knowledgeable and resourceful and willing to share your wisdom and time.

Thank you!

I guess its time for an "A-10 Strafing Run" on sunny and the rest of the BDS sufferers (even though my nic has nothing to do with the "Thunderbolt II").

Becoming an F-102 pilot required nearly two years of training on Active Duty. When LT Bush was completing his pilot training, he was doing so along with other National Guard, Air Force Reserve, and Active Air Force pilot trainees. The washout rate for pilot training is quite a bit higher than other types of training based on the complexity of the aircraft and the skill necessary to complete the training. If you are critizing him for becoming a F-102 pilot, you are dishonoring hundreds of F-102 pilots, many of which died flying that aircraft.

Following graduation from basic pilot training, jet fighter training, and specialized F-102 training, LT Bush reported to his squadron to assume his role as a fighter-interceptor pilot. From July 1970 to April 1972 he flew missions for the 111th Fighter Interceptor Squadron. He received high rating for his duty and skill as a pilot.

His "drill" requirement during this period would have resulted in 96 drill points earned (earned at the rate of two points for every "drill" day). However, during this period LT Bush amassed about 210 points (See Dasein Libsbane's comment at September 20, 2007 02:12 PM). The difference, about 115 points (earned at the rate of one point per day) reflect 115 days flying interceptor missions or other Active Duty for Training activities. (I might point out that the 115 days flying interceptor missions in an inherently dangerous aircraft is close to the number of days John "Seared in my Brain" Kerry served in Vietnam)

To say that LT Bush did not serve his country honorably while a member of the Texas Air National Guard is to ignore the facts and is an insult to the Texas ANG, ANG fighter pilots, and the National Guard in general (Full disclosure: I am a retired Army National Guard officer, my father-in-law was an Air National Guard fighter pilot and a Major General, and my borther-in-law is an Air National Guard fighter pilot and Brigadier General). LT Bush was required to amass 50 points per year after his intial period of Active Duty for Training. He amassed nearly 90 points per year. He met, and exceeded, his duty requirements.

The bottom line is that liberal, partisan hacks (Dan Rather, Mary Mapes, and others) attempted to influence a Presidential election by concocting a story (which had already been de-bunked) using fake documents. They tried to advance a lie that LT Bush was given preferential treatment in joining the Texas ANG, even though the Squadron Commander stated that he didn't receive such treatment. They tried to advance a lie that LT Bush failed to complete his military service requirement, when the facts clearly prove that he did. They tried to use unverified documents from an unreliable source and pass them off as fact, just weeks before a Presidential election, and then they try to claim that they were just doing "investigative journalism" when it's obvious what they were trying to do: sabotage President Bush's reelection.

If you continue to believe the "Bush AWOL" lie, you haven't been drinking the koolaid, you have been swimming in it.

Dasein: That Tom foley?

Geez, I forgot all about THAT Tom Foley!

I give up. Who’s Tom Foley? - mack55

Does the corruption on the Democrat side just elude them or are liberals just stupid?

In 1994, then Speaker Tom Foley, D-Wash., was slow to react to growing scandals surrounding the operations of the House Bank and the House postal system. There were early warnings that things were amiss but it took Foley and the rest of the Democratic Leadership months to respond and by then the entire matter had spun out of control.

So many scandals, so little time. Lol! Anyway, my apologies to Tom Foley the infielder.

Tom Foley... Oops! I meant Mark Foley. Tom Foley played infield, mostly for the Expos. My apologies to Tom Foley.

keef, I meant "nic" as short for nickname.

I knew who you meant, Rico; to be honest, I had forgotten that "Mark" was Foley's first name. And thanks for the answer on "nic," too.

mack5.5IQ,

I'm glad you've joined our blog, ex-"Marine." You see, your troll-puke friends always chide me for my "juvenile" behaviour, and then along comes one of their own--older than I, and twice as juvenile. You're an asset to me, bro; keep up the good work, and continue to post sh*t we read here, in many cases, years ago. Semper FI, ex-"GI."

Kahn, your nic reply is also correct--thanks...

I only read your question. Not the original context.

A-10 says:

His "drill" requirement during this period would have resulted in 96 drill points earned (earned at the rate of two points for every "drill" day). However, during this period LT Bush amassed about 210 points.

Hey A-10,
I’ve heard that cocaine is a stimulant of the central nervous system and that might explain all the extra points LT Dubya amassed.

I also have two technical questions for you.
1. Was LT Potus using an aircraft when he amassed those flying points?
2. Is it possible to wear an oxygen mask with a rolled up dollar bill hanging out of a nostril?

Hey, Dasein Libsbane,

Heads up. I was contacted by a gentleman who says he’s an investigator with the Santa Monica P.D. He told me the department knows who you are and that they’ve had you under surveillance. What the fu*% man? I thought you were just a towel thief.

I have one technical question for mack5.5IQ:

Is it possible to drive a car with a dildo shoved up your bum?

Just going to the source; I thought you might know...

Pia,

I had you all wrong, you’re okay.
Ricorun, Retired Spook, Dasein Libsbane, neocon, and Kahn all started spinning some bull shit about Tom Foley and you stood up like a man and admitted you were talking about Mark Foley.
You’ve got guts. Semper Fi.

Semper fi right back at you asshole.

Bush did his service. CBS ran with forged documents. Now that it's going to be in court maybe we'll find out who forged them.

So, we jump all over corrupt Republicans. But corrupt Democrats are immune? OK. Gotcha. Just wanted to be sure we had the rules straight.

Your posts are hate filled rants. Give us a break, OK?

mack5.5IQ--at best,

Rico was talking about Mark Foley; he just got the name mixed up.

As I said earlier, keep on keepin' on with your juvenile behaviour. It takes the heat off the attack dog.

Kahn, don't get all spun up over an intellectual pygmy. An ex-"Marine" doesn't stack up against you--a real Marine. Semper Fi, bro...

keef: Rico was talking about Mark Foley; he just got the name mixed up.

It turns out that wasn't ALL I got mixed up -- Mark Foley's nic was maf54! So I got it completely wrong. Sorry about that, mack55.

maf54 is still awful close to mack55...

After reading some of the last comments, this may be a bit off track...

But, back to Dan "Rather forge documents because I can't come up with anything good at the time"...Santa Claus and The Easter Bunny are "well documented" also...

I would have to ask for the documentation. I do find it pitiful that several others behind the story were fired from CBS, but "Courage" Dan didn't have what it took to stand up for them...after all, it was HIS story.

mack55IQ

"LEEEAVE BUUUUUUSSSSH ALLLLLONE!….."

Mack55IQ,

Go back to school and learn to spell. IQ55 is a stretch for you.

Go back to school and learn to spell. IQ55 is a stretch for you.

SEW, it's "IQ5.5--at best..."

Pia Pium,

IQ5.5 is the same as a parrot. I stand corrected. Thanks! SEW

IQ5.5 is the same as a parrot. I stand corrected. Thanks! SEW

A parrot? Yep--a bird brain!!!