Mark - except for a fringe minority which all of us agree are horribly confused - the vast majority of those who oppose the war do not think that those who are fighting aren't valiant or brave. Sure you can point to a few people who get attention in the media - but even you have to recognize that this is a tiny fraction of the anti-war group. If you disagree - prove me wrong..

The same things goes for those who are risking their lives involved in the reconstruction.

What I disagree with though is that those who are *in charge* of the reconstruction are doing a good job. How many scandals involving Haliburton contracts and missing billions have to happen before you realize the people who you are praising are the ones that are exploiting those that you support. Its the Bush administration and the military industrial complex that is letting the poor do their dirty work while Dick Cheney and the lot of them get ever richer of the blood of the American and Iraqi people.

KBlack.

At least get your facts correct or provide proof of how Cheney can possibly benefitting for reconstruction in Iraq.

Maye you might want to read some actual facts, instead of theory..
http://www.factcheck.org/article261.html

As for companies involved with any government contracts, even right here in the USA, there is always mismanagement and wasted billions.... go and read the GAO website..

It's nothing new and has been going on for decades.

All which has nothing to do with the successes in reconstruction that is going on in Iraq.

You want to talk about waste and corruption in the reconstruction of Iraq, that's fine but please don't use it to try to diminsh that actual successes that are ongoing

"The true story is out there, it just has to be dug up". Yeah, like a dead body. The "good news" from Iraq is just as missing as WMDs, a unified country and democracy.
Interesting that you said "true story" and not good news. I guess because there is none.

Perhaps what we're doing in Iraq is holding off the inevitable tough choices and responsibility the people of that country are now faced with. By continuing to provide a common target through our occupation for every extremist group on all sides of the conflicts there, we have become a distraction to progress.
What that country's politics look like when the dust settles is not controllable by us and it was foolish to think it was before we invaded. Perhaps they will see that development will flow in as soon as they can provide a stable government and in turn join the global economy. Perhaps they won't. Our being there will not decide their future decisions.

How many scandals involving Haliburton contracts and missing billions have to happen before you realize the people who you are praising are the ones that are exploiting those that you support.

It's "Halliburton," btw, and if there's so much scandal, how come there's no indictments. Even a dim bulb such as yourself, kblack, should know that money is misused in government constantly, even here in the states. There's so much money floating around that even the government can't account for it all. Do some research, idiot, instead of blindly following your cult.

Its the Bush administration and the military industrial complex that is letting the poor do their dirty work while Dick Cheney and the lot of them get ever richer of the blood of the American and Iraqi people.

Straight from the Charlie Rangel playbook. Now you have less than zero credibility, kblack. Congrats, you're the stupidest, least-trustworthy troll on this blog. Be proud, little man.

And who follows kblack with the second-most stupid comment on this thread? None other than tomjeff, the mental midget. More talking points from the moron.

You two should read, or at least skim through, the link Mark provided. Then forward it to your masters in D.C.--it's evident that they're ignoring the truth as well.

In other news, Charlie Sheen--he of two-and-a-half brain cells--is gonna participate in a video claiming that the towers were brought down by our government. I forgave this idiot when he advanced the theory in the past; not this time.

Here's my own theory about the Twin Towers: it was global warming. The thermite that was planted in the towers had a low flash point, and global warming caused those temperatures to increase, igniting the thermite. Those who saw planes fly into the towers were suffering from heat exhaustion due to global warming, and saw mirages. The Pentagon was hit by an errant missile from Aberdeen Proving Grounds, conducting a test fire. Global warming caused the missile to veer off course. Those who thought they saw a jet hit the Pentagon were seeing a mirage cause by global warming. Shanksville? A meteor fell from the sky, due to global warming. All those people allegedly killed on those four jets? Global warming caused them all to get amnesia. Somebody please help find those people.

Now, why are all the trolls on B4B lobotomized lemming parrots? Global warming. Their brains have been fried by the increased warming of the earth's surface.

Glad to clear all that up for you...

Dick Cheney and the lot of them get ever richer of the blood of the American and Iraqi people.

Dick Cheney is getting richer off this war?

In point of fact, Cheney LEFT Halliburton in order to assume the Vice Presidency. Yes, I know, they gave him one hell of a severance package, but that was BEFORE he took office and BEFORE the war.

Sounds like the same old canard about Vietnam. It's the "military industrial complex" out to make money. Never mind that the North Viets and the VC communists were the aggressors. Never mind the massacres such as Hue, in which the death toll was 25 times that of My Lai. Never mind Vietman's invasion of Loas and Cambodia. Never mind Saddam's aggression against Kuwait. Never mind his failure to live up to the 1991 cease fire agreement. Never mind his flipped bird at the U.N. resolutions. Never mind his post-war attacks on Shiites and Kurds and the no-fly zones we had to establish in order to protect them. Never mind that we waited for TWELVE YEARS for Saddam to come clean. Nope, ignore all that, it's just the "military industrial complex" trying to make money.

Eisenhower gave us that term, just like Bush the Elder gave us "New World Order", much to the enjoyment of conspiracy buffs.

The "good news" from Iraq is just as missing as WMDs, a unified country and democracy.

Airplane, there IS democracy in Iraq. Unless the government has fallen apart and we haven't yet heard about it.

Unified country? I'll concede your correct here, but have you ever wondered WHO is causing the lack of unity? Could it just possibly be the terrorists ("insurgents") who are trying to tear the country apart, and not our policies?

No WMD? We've found about 500 chemical bombs. Your side doesn't like to crefit us with this, because they were made before 1991, and in yuor eyes "don't count", so to speak. However, our demand that Saddam account for his WMD goes all the way back to 1991 (and not merely that he stopped making them), and makes no disctinction on when they was made. For those of you who said Saddam had no WMD, and Bush lied by saying he did, YOU ARE THE LIARS!

Bigfoot,

Have you noticed how many of these trolls trot out the rhetoric that we've caused the Middle East to become unstable by invading Iraq? Does it give you the impression that these kooks are too young, or too brainwashed, to realize that the Middle East has been unstable for about 60 years, that terrorism has been a worldwide problem since long before either Bush was in the White House?

And the other day, I was listening to (DN)C-Span. "Kerosene" Maxine Waters was on, representing the Out of Iraq Caucus. Many of the callers were first-class kooks, probably trolls from B4B. Anyway, this segment proved one thing to me--for many people in this country, 9/11 was an aberration(sp?).

Many in this country are asleep. They need to wake up...

yes and how much stock does Cheney own in Haliburton?
Look if you are going to talk about WMDs - I will give you one guess to who the worlds largest cache's of WMDs in - and a good portion of those chemical bombs came from.

Of course other people did horrible things as well - for the 1000'th time - that somehow offset that the Bush administration did horrible things too...

Finally - of course I realize that Western Imperialism has been around for much longer than the Bush administration - though he does bring an entirely new ridiculousness to the table..

Cheny getting rich from Stock options?

Obviously someone doesn't know their facts

the possibility that Cheney could profit from his Halliburton stock options if the company's stock rises in value. However, Cheney and his wife Lynne have assigned any future profits from their stock options in Halliburton and several other companies to charity. And we're not just taking the Cheney's word for this -- we asked for a copy of the legal agreement they signed, which we post here publicly for the first time.

The "Gift Trust Agreement" the Cheney's signed two days before he took office turns over power of attorney to a trust administrator to sell the options at some future time and to give the after-tax profits to three charities. The agreement specifies that 40% will go to the University of Wyoming (Cheney's home state), 40% will go to George Washington University's medical faculty to be used for tax-exempt charitable purposes, and 20% will go to Capital Partners for Education , a charity that provides financial aid for low-income students in Washington, DC to attend private and religious schools.

The agreement states that it is "irrevocable and may not be terminated, waived or amended," so the Cheney's can't take back their options later.

The options owned by the Cheney's have been valued at nearly $8 million, his attorney says. Such valuations are rough estimates only -- the actual value will depend on what happens to stock prices in the future, which of course can't be known beforehand. But it is clear that giving up rights to the future profits constitutes a significant financial sacrifice, and a sizeable donation to the chosen charities.

Hmmm 77...can't rationalize your remarks, so place the blame on the US to cover your tracks.

Smells pretty bad right now, and I ain't talkin bout yo feetz.

Since you asked Black..

Cheney at this time owns 0... as in zero shares of Halliburton.

And of the shares he did own before he became VP they were placed in an irrevocable trust. An independent report done on the trust found that Cheney nor family would gain or lose for that matter, from any action of the Halliburton stock.

Here is the link to a copy of the trust itself.

http://www.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/Cheney%20Gift%20Trust%20Agreement.pdf

In simpler terms... he gained 0 from any movement of Halliburton stocks..

not at all Navy

Look if you want to call names - call names. It only shows how weak your arguments are...

If you want to hide your head in the sand and still believe that we did the world some great service in Iraq - there is nothing I can do. The only thing I can do is to appeal to people to do the research and look at the facts.
Iraq did not pose a threat to the US.
Iraq did not have a connection to 9/11.

They did this to continue their imperialist policies and nothing more. If you think otherwise consider the following:
1) There were no WMDs - period - nonsense aside - not the type that Bush told us he did
2) The 9/11 commission found no evidence to link Iraq and 9/11 though Bush told us over and over and over again that there was a link
3) some of the worlds most terrorist supporting states are our friends (Saudi Arabia - where most of the 9/11 hijackers came from) coincidently they also offer us cheap oil (for those who think gas is expensive i encourage you to go to europe and buy gass)
4) Bush could care less about democracy in the middle east - why ignore Saudi Arabia one of the worlds most brutal monarchies?

It never added up and it never will. Just admit it

yes and how much stock does Cheney own in Haliburton?

kblack, you display a colossal degree of ignorance with this remark. VP Cheney exercised over $8 million in Halliburton stock options 2 years ago and donated it all to charity.

Vice President and Mrs. Cheney released their 2005 federal income tax return today. The return shows that the Cheneys owe federal taxes for 2005 of $529,636 on taxable income of $1,961,157. The Cheneys' adjusted gross income in 2005 was $8,819,006 which was largely the result of the exercise by an independent gift administrator of stock options that had been irrevocably set aside in 2001 for charity. The Cheneys donated $6,869,655 to charity in 2005 from the exercise of these stock options under the terms of the Gift Administration Agreement and from Mrs. Cheney's book royalties from Simon & Schuster on her books America: A Patriotic Primer, A is for Abigail: An Almanac of Amazing American Woman, and When Washington Crossed the Delaware: A Wintertime Story for Young Patriots. As provided in the Gift Administration Agreement, gifts were made to three designated charities named in that Agreement. The Cheneys' return was filed on March 20, 2006.

Wonder how much of his royalties and speeking fees Algore donates to charity. The year before he ran against GWB, Gore donated $350.00 (Yes, three hundred and fifty dollars) to charity.

I will give you one guess to who the worlds largest cache's of WMDs in - and a good portion of those chemical bombs came from.

This sentence is incoherent. What exactly are you trying to say?

Oops, "speeking" = speaking.

kblack77 is incorrect when he says the vast majority oppose the war. The vast majority oppose the way the war is being waged. The vast majority also oppose cutting and running.

not buying it for a second spook - cheney made millions and millions and millions from haliburton

what i am saying about the chemical weapons is that the US has the largest chemical weapons, nuclear weapons, and general weapons cache. Given how often we use them irresponsibly its hypocritical to occupy other countries for having them too

http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0403-10.htm

for example

Funny. I didn't see any links to documents that prove their talking points, kblack77 ... not even links to forged documents.

Since we have WMD, we should tell Iran that we will annihilate their country if they don't give back the Brits.

Oh, that's right! We don't play the same dangerous game Iran does. Gee, you think that's the main reason we don't want them to have WMD? Or perhaps, we should let them have them, as kblack77 suggests, and hope they don't use them.

yes and how much stock does Cheney own in Haliburton?

kblack, Cheney exercised all $8 million in Halliburton stock options 2 years ago, and along with the royalties from his wife's books, donated it all to charity.

Sorry for the repetition. My computer is doing funny things today.

so now your contending that he made no money from Haliburton - i could care less that he sold his stock 2 years ago - the war started 4 years ago

so now your contending that he made no money from Haliburton - i could care less that he sold his stock 2 years ago - the war started 4 years ago
and he didn't give all the money he made from them to charity - so quit it

"kblack, you display a colossal degree of ignorance with this remark. VP Cheney exercised over $8 million in Halliburton stock options 2 years ago and donated it all to charity."

Thank you for proving how corrupt Cheney and his supporters are. Yes, he did indeed "give" it to charity, but let's dig under the surface a moment: what charity did he give it to?

Well, the bulk of it went to (drum roll) The Richard B. Cheney Cardiac Institute at Washington University, a charity that is administered by the Cheney family. So it was offset twice against tax records, one for VP Cheney and once for the charity, and we still have no record of what happened to the money after that. A Cheney gives to a Cheney, and spook claims it's all been done in the name of charity?

And while we're on the topic, Cheney continues to hold 100,000 shares in Halliburton, since in July of 2006 they exercised a two for one deal on his remaining 50,000 shares.

Tell me again how "charitable" Cheney is and how much of an interest he doesn't hold in Halliburton?

Wow... a man gives money to a charity that is close to his heart (no pun intended) and all you do is try and smear him by saying he's laundering money that way. Sounds like what Al Gore is doing with giving money to offset his carbon use to a company he partly owns (in the same way you say Cheney owns Halliburton).

Further, if Cheney owns 100,000 shares of Halliburton per your own statement, he owns 5% of the Halliburton stock your good buddy George Soros owns (he owns two million shares).

So... where's your moral outrage now? Soros is against the War in Iraq but not opposed to making money off of it. NOW THAT'S WAR PROFITEERING if I've ever heard it.

right wally - i am outraged at anyone who profits from war - so if you have another - lets get him too..

why does that absolve the VP of anything?

Wawilliyo, I appreciate your point - But we're also saying the war should NEVER HAVE TAKEN PLACE in which case who profits from it is irrelevant. If it hadn't happened, nobody could have profited from it.

Start something like this, and everyone will want a slice of the pie. Two wrongs don't make a right, and the first wrong was starting a phony war in the first place.

Well Whisperwolf... just as I cannot possibly agree with you in what I firmly believe to be faulty reasoning to arrive at your claim that this was a phony war.

And no matter how hard you try, will I agree with you. I'd love to have a window into an alternate Universe where we didn't get rid of Saddam Hussein and only focused on Afghanistan.

And with that window, it'd be VERY interesting to figure out what your excuses would be for the "phony war" in Afghanistan... because as I'm sure you'd end up saying, the average Afghanis weren't responsible for 9/11, and the Taliban aren't in power anymore... so we should get the heck out.

I assume you're more intellectually honest that people like Pelosi who will in the very same statement say that Iraq isn't part of the War on Terror and then say that it is, but we should focus on ONLY Afghanistan but we can't forget what's going on in Iraq.

I appreciate you at least not trying to stand on both sides of the fence and ride it at the same time.

Oops... I was trying to be concise and quick and made a typo....

This paragraph should read THIS way...
And no matter how hard you try, will I NEVER agree with you. I'd love to have a window into an alternate Universe where we didn't get rid of Saddam Hussein and only focused on Afghanistan.

wally your argument is fairly hollow. You can't just say - oops well sorry about that whole invasion for no reason thing- well i guess we have no choice but to continue an unjustified and stupid action.

If you admit that its a mistake - why not try to get yourself out of that mistake rather than just continuing the stupidity...

kblack... don't ascribe your warped logic (as displayed in the prior thread about Iran) to me.

I don't believe invading Iraq was wrong, nor do I believe staying there as the democratically elected government has asked us to do is "morally" repugnant as you seem to ascribe.

You seem to be the one who wants to deal with the reality of us being in Iraq... nor do you accept the reality that leaving that country won't return it to the illusion of Shangri-la that you seem to think Iraq was under Saddam Hussein.

If you want to ramble the same useless and counterproductive arguments you've posted here since your first day; go ahead. As I shared with Whisperwolf, there is no point in going around in circles. No one is going to convince anyone of their ENTIRE belief system on this issue. I'll never convince you that this war WAS justified and made sense and that we should figure out what to do from that frame of reference anymore than you'll be able to convince me that we should just abandon all hope because Iraq was SOOOOOO SUPER under Saddam and we've messed it up (or whatever argument you'll try and pitch this time).

The only continual stupidity that is going on is you thinking your voice is making ANY impact here whatever. At least I've figured out that you're past trying to communicate with in a pragmatic way. Hopefully you'll arrive there too. Maybe after the House passes a clean war supplemental.

of course things weren't great under Saddam - show me one post when I claimed this..

Its that I disagree with the premise that one can force peoples lives to be better under occupation, bombings, and at gun point. Remember - we supported Saddam during his worst and most brutal years- under another of your favorites - Regan

Well, the bulk of it went to (drum roll) The Richard B. Cheney Cardiac Institute at Washington University, a charity that is administered by the Cheney family.

Whisperwolf, not according to this anti-Cheney site

FactCheck.org also weighs in:

The "Gift Trust Agreement" the Cheney's signed two days before he took office turns over power of attorney to a trust administrator to sell the options at some future time and to give the after-tax profits to three charities. The agreement specifies that 40% will go to the University of Wyoming (Cheney's home state), 40% will go to George Washington University's medical faculty to be used for tax-exempt charitable purposes, and 20% will go to Capital Partners for Education , a charity that provides financial aid for low-income students in Washington, DC to attend private and religious schools.

The agreement states that it is "irrevocable and may not be terminated, waived or amended," so the Cheney's can't take back their options later. (emphasis - mine)

Unless you consider 40% "the bulk of", and you meant George Washington University instead of Washington University, otherwise, you're full of crap.

And while we're on the topic, Cheney continues to hold 100,000 shares in Halliburton, since in July of 2006 they exercised a two for one deal on his remaining 50,000 shares.

WW, do you have a credible link to confirm this?

I love it... hindsight out in full effect to justify actions taken today. Here's a newsflash for you; Iranians, with the support of the GOVERNMENT of Iran, invaded sovereign U.S. soil, kidnapped 66 American individuals and held 52 of them hostage for 444 days. The Iran-Iraq War started during this conflict so I wonder who we'd support in that endeavor? Who would you have supported? Terrorists who are holding U.S. citizens hostage or a terrorist who wants to defeat terrorists holding U.S. Hostages?

Out of curiosity? Are you in favor of U.S. military intervention in Darfur? Are you in favor of U.S. intervention ANYWHERE? Are you in favor of having a military? Or are you just in favor of having an army as long as it doesn't actually DO anything?

The only thing Kblack, that you seem to support is a position of U.S. weakness. Explain to me how you see the world in five years...

I'll bet it will start out by "pulling out of Iraq." You'll then make some INSANE assertion that Iraq will turn into some Disneyland type place where Muslims aren't dying (or you'll say it'll get worse but who cares because they aren't Americans). You'll then say that Iran will listen to reason and not develop nuclear weapons because they saw the "nobility" of American foreign policy under a kblack administration. Then the world will break out all at once, join hands, and sing some secular reworking of "Kumbaya." And once that happens, Global Warming will cease, the violence in Darfur will cease.

Does that sound about right for you? We all know this is the world you think would exist if Bush weren't president. Do you have the nads to take ownership of this vision, or at minimum explain where it's slightly different? Or do you have ability to explain how your view (as you seem to show it here at B4B) is actually different from this TOTAL fantasy world?

where to start wally , where to start

a) its not hindsight - i didn't support this war EVER - plane and simple..

b) I am not sure what the Iranian hostage situation has to do with this at ALL. Explain your logic how a different government close to 30 years ago doing something horrible has anything to do with what happened in the last few weeks?

c) I am only in favor of military action when it is shown to be an absolute necessity. The last time that that the US did this - in my opinion - was WWII where we were bombed by the Japanese and facing the third reich taking over europe.

Do I favor military action in Darfur? It depends on what happens. Note btw that Bush has done almost nothing in Darfur. Anyway - what I would like to see is this brought to the UN floor - and first
a) have a statement denouncing the atrocities and the beginning of an international effort to stop this. First political - pass a resolution in the UN which states that what is going on now has to stop - if it doesn't immediately then send in UN peace keeping troops.
b) ideally the whole operation would be handled through the UN which the US would give money and troops if necessary working under the UN in order to stop the atrocities if political pressure and the treat of peace keeping troops didn't work.

Am I in favor of having a military? A free standing military? I am in favor of having enough of a military to provide security of the US.

Do I think that Iraq will become a disney land ? Of course now - Iraq will most likely be a complete mess for decades to come. I never said that it would become disney land.

Look - nobody is particularly happy with the idea of the current Iranian government having nuclear weapons. But you have to understand that everything this administration does makes it MORE likely for them to pursue them. Why? Its not hard to see - any body who poses any real threat to them they don't go near. Why isn't the Bush administration fighting a war with North Korea - because they have a huge military and it seems now at least some nuclear capability. Iran understand s this - its not hard to see - its the same reason the US plays softball with Pakistan ever since it went Nuclear.

Look - I don't have to defend what you have decided I believe it. I don't think this world is fantasy and that we should all hold hands and sing peace songs. Unfortunately that almost certainly will never happen - I recognize that terrorism, nuclear proliferation, etc are real threats. Its not that - its that I think that everything this administration does makes those threats worse. By acting as if they are a comic book hero and demanding that we are the only ones who get nuclear weapons, chemical weapons, and get to decide what the rest of the world should do or either punish them economically, politically, or militarily. That is the part i don't agree with..

Stop this nonsense - its about as bad as saying that if you disagree with me you are with the terrorists. Nobody wants these things - its how we deal with these real problems that differentiates us...

Whispoerwolf,

Get your facts right about what charities Cheneys interests went to.

The "Gift Trust Agreement" the Cheney's signed two days before he took office turns over power of attorney to a trust administrator to sell the options at some future time and to give the after-tax profits to three charities. The agreement specifies that 40% will go to the University of Wyoming (Cheney's home state), 40% will go to George Washington University's medical faculty to be used for tax-exempt charitable purposes, and 20% will go to Capital Partners for Education , a charity that provides financial aid for low-income students in Washington, DC to attend private and religious schools.

Irregardless if it's the for or against people who write articles or post claims.... at least do some research and find out the facts... instead of repeating made up lies.

kblack,

Most everyone else has already covered your objections. I'll just add this:

In any human endevour there is going to be imperfection; you know this full well. What you do wrong - what you do that is actually immoral - is when you too easily ascribe base motivations for all bad events. You are exhibiting a complete lack of charity and a negation of all that is justice.

We are all commanded to do everything to the very best of our ability - but, being human, we invariably fail to carry out the command. You fail, I fail, everyone fails - including the people who work for Halliburton. What you are convinced are nefarious actions - without, I might add, any actual evidence of same - are far more likely the result of overworked, stressed out men and women, some of whom are working in a dangerous war zone and all of whom are imperfect human beings to begin with. When someone cuts you off on the highway, do you automatically presume that the person was deliberately trying to cause you harm, or do you understand - even though you are frightened and angry - that it was probably just thoughtlessness which was likely brought on by the person being distracted by any one of a thousand things?

There are war profiteers. There are politicians who take bribes. But hardly anyone is a war profiteer or a politician who takes a bribe...most people, after all, are just like you...and unless you think you are downright evil, you should work on the assumption that anything going wrong is more than likely the result of the normal frictions of fallible human beings at work.

thats just great Mark...

They start a war , kill thousands of people, repeal the constitution, need I go on?

But because I didn't give them enough credit for just being stupid and making a mistake - I am the immoral one.
Nope - not for a second Mark - not for a second

WhiteHouse.gov:

The Terrorists Consider Iraq "The Central Battlefield" In The War On Terror. THE PRESIDENT: "But they've made clear that the most important front in their struggle against America is Iraq - the nation bin Laden has declared the 'capital of the Caliphate.' Hear the words of bin Laden: 'I now address... the whole... Islamic nation: Listen and understand... The most... serious issue today for the whole world is this Third World War... [that] is raging in [Iraq].' He calls it 'a war of destiny between infidelity and Islam.' He says, 'The whole world is watching this war,' and that it will end in 'victory and glory or misery and humiliation.' For al Qaeda, Iraq is not a distraction from their war on America - it is the central battlefield where the outcome of this struggle will be decided." (President Bush, Remarks, Washington, DC, 9/5/06)

You make it so very hard NOT to laugh sometimes.

*Sighs*

Well it's good to know that no matter what we do no one believes we're doing anything constructive.

kblack, its ok man. Remember this is "Blogs for Bush"; not "Blogs for Facts" or "Blogs for Reason. Mentioning Cheney and Halliburton in the same sentence automatically shuts off their hearing around these parts. No one seems to remember the Republican outrage and mouth-frothing that went on over Whitewater, let alone the full-out impeachment of Bill Clinton for; of all things - trying to get away with a bj.

Time and the truth will tell how interconnected Cheney’s occupation of the executive branch of the United States and Halliburton’s no-bid contract dominance was. As Halliburton spits in the face of our nation by moving to Dubai, we can just sit back and relax as the military-industrial complex grinds itself out.

So, I have a serious question:

Are we still expecting Iraq to be the first democratic domino in the Middle East that will transition the whole region to "peaceful" and "stable" states?

I only ask because that's the real reason we're there, right? To help blossom a nation that will go down in the history books as the one that reshaped the whole ME. I mean, at least that's what our Commander in Chief said...

My prediction goes as such:

-Iraqis agree to co-op the rightful heir of Mohammed; Shia’s –being the Iraqi majority- gets the majority of the weekdays; Monday, Wednesday, and Friday; Sunnis get the minority of the week, for obvious reasons; Tuesday and Thursday, but retain 70% of the weekends as they represent the fast majority of Muslims world wide. Halliburton is commissioned to build “Baghdad Disney”, located in Bush City (formerly Sadr/Saddam City).

-Next to turn to Western democracy will be Saudi Arabia, as the crown prince is convinced by prince Bandar that with a priceless familial domination comes social responsibility. Women are granted drivers licenses and the subsequent increase in commerce and tax revenues are used to invest in the capture and execution of bin Laden, along with the network of Saudi (now New Arabians) agents who facilitated the September 11th attacks,

-With OBL’s fall, Afghanistan (with the help of Pakistan) converts its poppy crop to corn, receiving generous state subsidies. The Taliban lays down its weapons and converts to Christianity.

-Surrounded by Christian nations, Iran’s Supreme Counsel realizes its tenuous position and re-instates all liberal/secular professors to the universities. The resultant brain-bump leads to the Third Renaissance. Tehranywood begins to put out highly-stylized well-scripted films that tout the advantages of free-market capitalism based on Puritan ideas of salvation and success.

-After receiving free nuclear power from reactors in Iran, Hezbollah becomes a power magnate and delivers free energy to Israeli and Palestinian alike. Under the glare of clean and free city streets, Hamas and Fatah unite with Lukid to build quality housing complexes and mini-malls where Lebanese citizens find cheap Chinese goods that add drastically to their quality of life.

-Syria, realizing Lebanon’s burgeoning economic dominance, dissolves the royal family in a peaceful ceremony at Camp David, and the two nations re-unite to become a popular tourist destination for Eastern Europeans.

Thusly, George Bush is hailed as a world-wide savior, receives the Nobel Peach Prize, and personally pens his Times Best-Selling auto-biography, complete with footnotes and glossy pictures in the middle 20 pages.

But of course, that’s just the way I see it going down…

Remember - we supported Saddam during his worst and most brutal years- under another of your favorites - Regan

As opposed to supporting, say, Iran? We protected the Persian Gulf, you colossal idiot. We kept the shipping lanes open. The enemy of my enemy, you idiot.

How old are you, kblack? You are the biggest idiot here; you're a broken record. And Halliburton has two "l's," moron. And learn how to use "you're" and "your" in the proper context. You must be a current college student. Go jump in front of a bus, please...

Remarks by Vice President Cheney to the Republican Jewish Coalition Leadership

The most common myth is that Iraq has nothing to do with the global war on terror. Opponents of our military action there have called Iraq a diversion from the real conflict, a distraction from the business of fighting and defeating bin Laden and al Qaeda. We hear this over and over again -- not as an argument, but as an assertion meant to close off argument. Yet the critics conveniently disregard the words of bin Laden himself: "The most... serious issue today for the whole world," he said, "is this Third World War...[that is] raging in [Iraq]." He calls it "a war of destiny between infidelity and Islam." He said, "The whole world is watching this war," and that it will end in "victory and glory or misery and humiliation." And in words directed at the American people, Osama bin Laden declares, quote, "The war is for you or for us to win. If we win it, it means your defeat and disgrace forever." This leader of al Qaeda has referred to Baghdad as the capital of the Caliphate. He has also said, and I quote, "Success in Baghdad will be success for the United States. Failure in Iraq is the failure of the United States. Their defeat in Iraq will mean defeat in all their wars." End quote.

Obviously, the terrorists have no illusion about the importance of the struggle in Iraq. They have not called it a distraction or a diversion from their war against the United States. They know it is a central front in that war, and it's where they've chosen to make a stand. Our Marines tonight are fighting al Qaeda terrorists in al Anbar Province. U.S. and Iraqi forces recently killed a number of al Qaeda terrorists in Baghdad, who were responsible for numerous car bomb attacks. Iraq's relevance to the war on terror simply could not be more plain. Here at home, that makes one thing, above all, very clear: If you support the war on terror, then it only makes sense to support it where the terrorists are fighting us. (Applause.)

kblack,

Repealing the constitution? Careful there, old buddy, you're treading real close to out-and-out kookery there.

And I didn't say stupid, I said "human". Have a little charity towards your brothers and sisters.

KBlack says - "They start a war , kill thousands of people, repeal the constitution, need I go on?"

NO, KB. No need to continue. We can tell you're a whack job from just that statement.

So, is the government housing troops in your house yet? Did they seize your car to transport high officials? Throw you in jail for speaking or writing your beliefs? Take away your guns" Oh wait, if you live in a Democrat controlled area, they might have. Stop you from voting? Make you incriminate yourself? Change the number of Supreme Court Justices to "pack" the court? Oh wait, FDR did that.

Ignorance at your age isn't funny.

"No WMD? We've found about 500 chemical bombs. Your side doesn't like to crefit us with this, because they were made before 1991, and in yuor eyes "don't count", so to speak."

I remember when those leftover rotting hulks were first found back in 2003. They weren't deemed enough by the White House or the right-wing media or the RNC to be trumpeted as WMDs (read: Those who supported President Bush never heard about them). Three years later Rick Santorum reannounced their existence when he was losing to Bob Casey Jr for his Senate seat. It got exposure on talk radio and the usual rightwing blogs as "We found the WMDs and the liberal media won't report them" but we never heard bupkus about it from the White House; the American public dismissed it all as too little too late; and Santorum was defeated anyway.

The story lives on, I guess, in the incestous group of the 29 percenters who never got the word that the whole story was horsehockey. Iraq was a mess long before we got there, will be a mess long after we're gone; and even the diehards won't do more than put stickers on the back of their SUVS.