The problem is, is that "Americans" are not marching in the street demanding that amnesty be given to 11 million illegal immigrants. Why can't we come together all over this country and protest what we believe. We are doing nothing - and we will all pay the very high price!

ok Mark, one easily concludes that Mexican nationalism bothers you.

lets be sure, however, to apply the same standard when African Americans, the Boston/NYC Irish, & the Miami Cubans display their respective flags & speak distinctively.

oh yea, please allow that some, perhaps many, in these latter groups are CINO (citizens in name only).

Why aren't Mexicans demonstrating in their own streets and demanding more and better jobs from their government?

Why don't those demonstrators and marchers who want America's borders opened to an uncontrolled flood of immigrants head down to Mexico - along with truckloads of America flags - and march down their streets. Perhaps Mexico's President Fox will help organize the marches!

Why doesn't Mexico's President Fox work at fixing his own problems in Mexico? Why is his problems American's to solve? Why does President Fox insist - no demand - that President Bush and Americans open our borders to an uncontrolled flood of their citizens and provide them with jobs and health care? Why doesn't President Fox offer to use some of Mexico's oil to reimburse the American taxpayers for the welfare, medical care, schooling, and social services we provide to the illegal immigrants?

Why can't President Fox be more pro-American if he wants and needs our help to do his job? Why isn't Mexico more supportive of America, our policies, and our war against terrorists who want to destroy America? How often do we hear President Fox and the Mexican government praising America? Don't recall any? Why do other countries talk so negative about America and then expect America to solve their problems?

For those who say that Mexicans are working at low paid jobs in Mexican factories and farms to supply goods to the American market, let's just remove those jobs from Mexico and send them to China and India. They will be happy to take the work!

When has the Mexican government done anything to help stop illegal immigrants from flooding across our border? Never, they encourage and support it! If Mexicans want to work in American, the do so legally and obey our laws. Do not flood across our borders illegally by the millions! Do not demand that American change it's laws to suit Mexico's desires!

If the problem is in Mexico, then go to Mexico to fix it, don't shift Mexico's problem to the American taxpayer to solve.

AAR

"all you have to do is decide to be American, and you are American"

While I believe that our laws should be enforced and illegals should all be summarily deported, regardless of the cost to us as a matter of principle (either enforce laws or get rid of them), I'm very sure that many, if not most of the illegals in this country would decide to be American if merely the decision is all it took.

The real culprit is the minimum wage. Because employers would have to pay legals the minimum wage, they find workers who will accept less, precisely what the free market does. The problem is that libs want it both ways. They want to have a minimum wage, but they don't want to do anything about those here illegally who aren't making that wage.

It's the libs actually that create the "slave-class" that is illegal americans. If they would just acknowledge that minimum wage created this problem and abolish it, I'd have no problem allowing any worker in who is willing to work. The simple fact is that most illegal aliens wouldn't NEED to be illegal if employers were allowed to import workers that would work for these wages IN THE OPEN. Instead, they have bring them in as illegals which gives them zero bargaining power because they can be reported.

The irony is that getting rid of the minimum wage, particularly for farm work, would HELP the democrats in that these immigrants would most likely unionize, since they would be able to get legal protection to do so, if they were allowed to come here legally to work for low wages.

I'm confused -- I thought Bush was pushing the guest-worker program. Isn't this "Blogs for Bush," or is my browser malfunctioning?

That is quite a strident summary of Hanson's article. But it doesn't characterize it very well.

I recommend others read the Hanson article; it's quite reasonable. (And I rarely agree with Hanson.) Don't let Noonan's caffeine-fueled screed distract you.

While I wuld say that both political parties have courted the Hispanic voter, and the most notorious of the flag incidents (upside down American flag) was perpetrated by high school students- there is a point here.
I live in uppermidwestern city with a population of about 390,000 (2000 census) an increase of about 10,000 over the 1990. During that interval an estimated 120,000-150,000 hispanics moved into the city. First off what happened to the 110,000-140,000 residents? There is no understimating the impact this has had on the city ie try to get a job, almost any job from fast food burger flipper to clinical nurse if you are not spanish speaking within the city it self. This one factor that being language has become in some ways an economic bludgeon in which it can seem that some hispanics are useing to develope a closed economy.
My city has and is seeing current influxes of immigrants from other countries- Somalia and Laos being magor ones but these immigrants assimilated and learned and USED english. This is true even in say an asian grocery store, I noticed that when I entered the store or approached the counter both proprieters and customers would automatically start speaking english which I take as we want your business, not so in a number of hispanic establishments however. What is the root cause of this I believe that illegel or undocumented immigrants have some thing to do with, this the language barrier makes it easier to hide in a crowd. The solution-I seriously don't think there is a blanket one size fits all fix. Questions such as how long have you been here and just what you been doing must play into it, but still I am willing to admit there is a problem and simply opening our borders won't fix it.

There you have from the keyboard of an otherwise certifiable moonbat- OMG I sorta agreed with Noonan-Have a good first weekend of spring folks.

While I wuld say that both political parties have courted the Hispanic voter, and the most notorious of the flag incidents (upside down American flag) was perpetrated by high school students- there is a point here.
I live in uppermidwestern city with a population of about 390,000 (2000 census) an increase of about 10,000 over the 1990. During that interval an estimated 120,000-150,000 hispanics moved into the city. First off what happened to the 110,000-140,000 residents? There is no understimating the impact this has had on the city ie try to get a job, almost any job from fast food burger flipper to clinical nurse if you are not spanish speaking within the city it self. This one factor that being language has become in some ways an economic bludgeon in which it can seem that some hispanics are useing to develope a closed economy.
My city has and is seeing current influxes of immigrants from other countries- Somalia and Laos being magor ones but these immigrants assimilated and learned and USED english. This is true even in say an asian grocery store, I noticed that when I entered the store or approached the counter both proprieters and customers would automatically start speaking english which I take as we want your business, not so in a number of hispanic establishments however. What is the root cause of this I believe that illegel or undocumented immigrants have some thing to do with, this the language barrier makes it easier to hide in a crowd. The solution-I seriously don't think there is a blanket one size fits all fix. Questions such as how long have you been here and just what you been doing must play into it, but still I am willing to admit there is a problem and simply opening our borders won't fix it.

There you have from the keyboard of an otherwise certifiable moonbat- OMG I sorta agreed with Noonan-Have a good first weekend of spring folks.

I just read this and if this isn't also an eye opener for the American people TO WAKE UP and see what is happening and will happen if we don't take care of the illegal immigration problem.

A guest worker program is needed but what they are proposing won’t work for several reasons.

The claim is they are taking jobs no American wants. Why is that? The work is hard and the pay is low but they are forced to take them because they are illegal. What will happen when they are given a permit to work in the US for 3 years + an extension. They will move up to better jobs. Who will fill the jobs they vacated? Illegal aliens because no legal alien wants them either. You can read the it yourself at

http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2006/03/29/hanging-our-flag-upside-down-underneath-the-mexican-flag/

I have to agree with you. Immigrants must play by the rules.

Throw those that hire illegal aliens in jail. (Yes, I mean you Tyson Chicken, WalMart, etc).

BTW, will never happen. The chances that our politicians will side with Americans over American corporations is nil.
They know who butters their bread.

Ahhh, for the days when being American carried some weight.

I do, however, find it hilarious to watch people realize the politicians they support don't give a whit about them.

This has been a fascinating issue without easy solutions. It seems that America is almost evenly split on this issue but not the usual liberal/conservative or republican/dem lines. White collar and corporate types (which is pretty much the entire congress and executive branch) are in favor of the proposed reforms because it means continued cheap labor and high profits. Bidness trumps patriotism and security every time for these types. Blue collar Americans, red state and blue, are more concerned about threats to their jobs and families.
So with everything else on this blog, including the title, in unquestioning support of dear leader; you realize your dissent on this issue makes you a traitor like the rest of us.
jeff

ya'll, I have to tell you, stay away from the whole flag waving thing, I live in San Antonio, pretty much the first stop for a lot of illegals coming through Texas, but like LA a place that was Latino before it was ever white. So you're mad they were waving Mexican flags, ok, then be mad at the Irish on St. Paddy's Day, etc. There are alot of Mexican families who have lived in areas of the south for centuries, and a lot are American citizens, everyone that is proud of their heritage isn't an illegal.

Hey, I have to add something to my previous comment, we do need to do something about the illegal problem, i don't have many ideas but
1. better enforcement
2. work with Mexico to provide jobs down there (outsourcing)
3. Work to round up any illegal who is a troublemaker
4. Let them have a path to citizenship (i know ya'll hate this) but living in Texas I've known my share of illegals, the vast majority want to be citizens, and they work damn hard to do it (as an aside my wife is an ESL teacher).
Our ancestors most likely showed up on a ship couldn't speak a lick of English but were given citzenship and sent on in, what did they do, they stayed in their own communities for a period of time but in a generation their children assimilated (heck for one of my grandparents it didn't even take a generation).
The difference they had Ellis Island etc. There was an easy mechanism, now admittedly the border is alot vaster, and I think as you people know Mexicans are not white they are Brown (hence alot of ya'll up in arms about this, sorry to say alot of conservatives are as racist as Farrakhan), but we need a sensible mechanism like existed in the past.
Sorry to rant but the blatant racism sometimes makes me mad. Ya'll take care and feel free to talk all the stuff you want about me when I'm gone. Bye.

Because no American of, say, Irish descent has even flown a flag other than Old Glory. Of course, you wouldn't have known that from walking around my town on St. Pat's Day. Maybe we should ship them all back to the Emerald Isle, yeah?

Matt,

Flying the Mexican flag is not what had folks up in arms so much as flying our flag upside down beneath it. That is a deliberate insult to the US, as it denotes replacement of sovereignity.

Deleted - Slanderous Comment

"Mexicans are not white they are Brown (hence alot of ya'll up in arms about this,"

You're projecting. I couldn't care less what color someone's skin is. I care about their attitude.

And, apparently some liberal site has come up with a talking point. All of a sudden, we've got a bunch of trolls all yelling about the Irish and St. Patrick's day. It's a ridiculous attempt at a comparison. The Irish on St. Patty's day aren't trying to force the country to ignore the law and give them handouts in the form of health care and welfare paid for by the hard work of others, and proclaiming that they have more rights to be in this country than it's legal citizens do.

The operative words are "illegal" and "security".

Our govt regulates the numbers of legal immigrants.

If R or D politicians had to justify the current numbers of total immigrants to the voters, they would not continue in office. Hence we get a pro-business policy of...Look the other way.

It certainly seems that the parties have a Pre-9/11 mentality regarding security and a pro-business mentality regarding workers and wages.

How cynical it is to allow this to happen. We are allowing undocumented people to cross our borders with...we don't know. It could be drugs, supposedly a scourge of both parties. It could be WMD, obviously a concern of the highest magnitude. And to me, the parties do this because it helps business.

As an illegal immigrant it must be very hard to expect:
*decent working conditions
*safe working conditions
*reasonable pay
*insurance or a pension...fugetaboutit

If not these reason...what?

1662 DAYS SINCE 9-11

Security...what's that?

LNC,

Are you insane?

Welcome to the shell game.
It's the illegals (who live 15+ in a hovel), the homeless (who lie around in their own shit and are full of disease) and welfare queens having babies (a.k.a. the black stereotype) that are taking advantage of us hard-working Americans.

Pay no attention to that Pharmaceutical company executive who has rigged the system by buying our politicians and receiving huge tax breaks and giveaways (your hard-earned tax dollars).

The people taking you for a ride are wearing 3-piece suits, you imbecile. They're not illegals.

May I buy you a cup of coffee and an alarm clock?

Wow, I would have never thought I'd agree with an opinion from a blog for bush. The political lines are really blurry on this issue aren't they? In my opinion, we need to cut off demand and impose harsh penalties on those who would employ illegals. To say they are only taking jobs that US workers don't want is a fallacy. I've seen illegals at construction sites doing work that used to be well-paid- drywalling, roofing, framing and the like. If you want America to look like Mexico with a modern infrastructure, just put your support in a guest-worker program.

LNC.

You need to get out of the hole you are in, more often and see all the white Mexicans out there.

Maibe if you get a job you can earn enough to travel to Mexico and learn. As to their attitude, you should focus on your's first bigot.

I would have no problem with Mexicans waving the Mexican flag on Cinco de Mayo just like I have no problem with the Irish waving their flag on St. Pat's. But since this wasn't anywhere close to May 5th, that's where the problem lies.

Well, that, and the fact that they were waving it at a rally thumbing their nose at our rules.

Scott,

As an American of Irish descent, I can assert with certainty that we never wanted America to kowtow to Irish culture. My father is proud of his Irish heritage, but he's 100% American...and as for me, I don't give two cents for my Irish ancestry...on the census forms, I put down my ethnicity as "American". The first person out of the Irish cracker-barrel in my ancestry got here in the 1840's...after more than 160 years, my connections to Ireland are rather tenuous...

It takes more than a decision to become an american. In fact it is a quite involved, expensive process. Very few people that are illegal immigrants want to be illegal immigrants.

Obviously, there are no easy answers. Many good people have taken great risks to come to a country where they feel they can provide a better life for their families, both here and at home (by sending money back to Mexico).

But once that first law is broken, without penalty, with some Americans making excuses to allow for the lawbreaking, then other laws are broken.

An entire subculture arises, one where some people forge documents and others buy them. There is the subculture of trying to establish Little Mexicos here in the United States, instead of trying to learn the language and customs of this country. And there is the pervasive attitude that if it is OK to break one law, the first law regarding entry, then no law has to be respected.

My brother was T-boned by an illegal Mexican alien, driving without a license, with open containers in his vehicle. He did not even get a ticket, though he ran a stop sign at a high rate of speed and threw a car with a man and two children into the air, on top of and over another car. It was his third such accident in three months. He was never cited for any of them. My brother has had two surgeries for his injuries and will be in pain for the rest of his life. But in his community, there is so much 'sensitivity' to the Mexican problem that being a Mexican is tantamount to having free rein to do whatever you want.

But once you've said it's OK to break the law to get here, and again to get forged papers, and again to lie to get a drivers license (if you even bother) and again to an employer to work, and maybe even to vote, where can a line be drawn? Can we say it's OK to break four laws, but not five? Can we say to the children of those illegals, although we have allowed you to defy our laws for years, we also want you to respect them?

The first step is to make clear and unambiguous statements that our laws must be respected, and that there are penalites for breaking them. No matter what the details may end up being, without that first and most basic step, nothing will ever be accomplished.

BTW, go read the entire article. La Raza is brazen about its intent to work with the Democratic Party to achieve its goals, and one of those goals is to take over what they call "Aztlan states".

Hillary was complaining in 2004 about the scarcity of translators in voting places, thereby depriving people of their right to vote. As most of us know that only (live) citizens can legally vote, and that naturalization requires passing an English test, WE knew that she was really complaining about non-citizens having a hard time voting. But this is clearly part of the Democratic plan to get more votes, anywhere and anyhow they can.

This problem is a whole lot deeper and more complex than merely guarding the border, or figuring out how to appropriately punish those who have broken our laws without having to embark on a huge and painful deportation plan. But it is getting clearer and clearer about who is promoting illegal immigration, and who is sucking up the most to those illegals in an effort to gain their votes, legal votes or not.

And it is NOT some 'corporation' or 'Big Bidness' driving this movement. It is politics far more than economics. If it was merely an economic concern, it would have been solved by now, with a rational plan for simplifying guest worker visas, etc. But it involves blatant pandering to a large potential voting block, and security or fairness or the rule of law be damned.

Thais,

If those illegals who marched this past week wanted to be American, all they had to do was chuck the Mexican flags, march under Old Glory and then sing God Bless America at the conclusion of the march...had they done that, a majority of Americans would have been in favor of getting them on the quick path to citizenship...but, no, they had to come in here and be Mexicans demanding things from Americans....

I don't really get the discomfort on the cultural front in this debate.

I certainly understand the economic and security concerns, and for that reason am strongly committed to the idea that illegal immigration has to be curtailed. It also seems like problem with a fairly straight-forward, though difficult, even painful solution. If both supply and demand were cut for illegal workers, illegal immigration would be at manageable levels. The ways to take care of this are already there--punish employers who hire illegals severly, even if they do so through subcontractors, a la Walmart, and pressure/support Mexico in developing a working economy and social saftey net.

The history of Irish immigration, much discussed here and elsewhere is complicated, and has something to teach us in this event. 19th century Irish immigrants did not immediately become regular, white-bread Americans. They were allowed in because they would do hard labor for wages that were tantamount to indentured servitude. And if you look at WASP editorials of the day, Americans were terrified that the influx of Irish (and later Poles, Italians, and so on) would destroy the American national character, morality, etc. Becoming really American took these immigrants years and years, and was accomplished through a variety of things, notably participation in the labor movement that brought you things like the weekend and the minimum wage. Mind you, in the process they were often described as traitors and anti-American. No doubt now they would be called economic terrorists or some such.

So complain that illegal immigrants are driving down wages for all non-skilled, uneducated workers, and to some degree skilled laborers. And do something about it by pressuring the government to make changes that will fix it (unlike the 'guest worker' program that will simply institutionalize sub-standard conditions and wages for these jobs). But what is your gripe with Mexican-American immigrants creating insular communities--mind you, not composed entirely of illegals, by any means? I grew up in California's central valley, and have lived in Chicago for years. I've seen places deeply colored by Chicano culture. It's really not that different from asian immigrants creating Chinatowns, or from little Italys, Polishtowns, and so on in the 19th century. I've never been made to feel unwelcome in Mexican-American-run businesses in Ca or the midwest, or Philly, for that matter. They have their own churches, but then, so do Poles, and Koreans, and African Americans, and Jews (as it were). Seems pretty reasonable.

As for taking money from American taxpayers, California and New York are two of the biggest net providers of money to the federal government (that is, they pay in more than they get back). Alabama, Arkansas, and Mississippi are some of the biggest net recipients of federal tax dollars. So who is it that is sucking money from hard-working American tax payers?

You are right Matt, about them coming here and demeaning OUR flag, and waving the Mexican Flag,
along with making demands. IT JUST AIN'T GONNA WASH WITH AMERICAN CITIZENS. EVERYONE THAT I READ
ABOUT OR TALK WITH, HAS HAD IT.

IT WAS SAID A WHILE BACK, THAT THE "POLITICOS READ
THE BLOGS RIGHT? WELL, THEY ALL BETTER GET THE MESSAGE, THAT THE PUBLIC IS TIRED OF THIS BECOMING
A BIGGER PROBLEM FOR AMERICANS ALREADY SICK AND TIRED OF THE THOUGHTS OF TERRORISM, AND BOTH "THE
REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS BETTER PUT THIS ILLEGAL
ALIEN ISSUE TO BED"....."THEY ARE HERE ILLEGALLY,
AND WE DON'T HAVE TO BE QUIET WHILE POLITICOS OF BOTH PARTIES, TELL LEGAL AMERICANS, WHAT THEY ARE
NOW "FORCED TO DO"....GIVE THEM THE AMNESTY(CAUSE
THAT'S ALL THESE PLANS ARE) AND THEY WILL REPORT TO BECOME LEGAL,....STUPID REMARKS, CAUSE THEY WON'T...DON'T...AND WILL NOT. IT WAS TIRED BEFORE
REMEMBER? THEY DON'T PAY THE TAXES, AND THEY WON'T PAY IN THE FUTURE. AS ONE POST ABOVE SAID,

"THEY HAVE THE LOW PAYING JOBS NOW, BUT WILL "WANT
TO MOVE TO BETTER JOBS, AND MORE WILL COME TO FILL
THE LOW END JOBS, AND SO ON, AND SO ON.

OUR POLITICAL LEADERS, INCLUDING PRESIDENT BUSH,
THAT I FOR ONE OF MANY, WORKED TIRELESSLY TO GET ELECTED A 'SECOND TIME', BETTER REALIZE, WE "ARE NOT HAPPY WITH HIS 'LATER THAN YOU THINK PLAN', AND HE BETTER GET TOUGHER ON THIS, AS "OUR LAWS ARE LAWS....AND THESE INVADERS, "ARE ILLEGAL, AND
LAST TIME I CHECKED, IT WAS AGAINST OUR LAWS, THAT
HE OR NO ONE ELSE SEEMS TO GIVE A RAT'S ASS ABOUT,
INCLUDING HIS FRIEND VICENTE FOX. I'VE HAD IT!

Jo,

Your leaders do not care about you or your opinions. You're an American citizen who is upset. BFD.

How much money have you given your leaders?
Money talks.
Corporations give big money to your leaders.
Their opinion means something to our leaders.

As GWB would say you are just a member of a focus group.

Again. They do not care what you think.
Read it, learn it, live it.