Mark Noonan in "Surveying the Scene" bemoans our current political scene. He writes “…no matter how you slice it, we have been degraded into a very sick political reality these days.” He then goes on to make the statement “For our opponents on the left, the only thing I can see motivating them is hatred - nasty, snide, spiteful hatred.” Well Mark baby, sounds like your more part of the problem then the solution.

One might conclude that anyone who looks at a group of his fellow countrymen and women, who number in the millions, and can see only “hatred” as their motivation, is not really willing to look at or listen to them. Not a good step toward healing our current “sick political reality”. Open your eyes and your mind (and maybe your heart) Mark!

Are there individuals on the left filled with hatred? I can’t say, but common sense and statistics tell me there probably are. Same question about the right and I get the same answer. This should really be a no-brainer. Mark Noonan’s blanket indictments are worse than useless, much worse.

Finally, the King’s devoted their lives to fighting social injustice. I’m sure it is altogether fitting to speak of it at their funerals.

I've been saying this all day, so I'll say it again here - there was a marked contrast between the first and second halves of the program.

The first half was full of beautiful music, especially the rendition of the "Lord's Prayer," and very good remarks by both Bushes. GWB spoke to the nation and I thought his tone and content were just right. I've never seen Bush Sr. so at ease and loose. He was very well received. The Mayor of Atlanta and Ms. Anjilou were very respectuful and appropriate for the occasion.

Duane,

Hatred and evil live in the heart of every person - but I'm holding to my statement: the left, as a political entity, is motivated entirely by hatred. It is the left which poisons the political system, it is the left which brings out the worst in all of us.

I hold myself in check, I try not to show anger, I pray for those who insult me...but the people on the left, they are in desperate need of help.

Paul Wellstone, Rosa Parks, and now Coretta Scott King. It saddens me, angers me, and frightens me that such a large segment of society not only cannot put aside partisan vitriol for even the most solemn of occasions, but that they see nothing wrong with it. There is nothing, nothing more important to these extremists than getting back in power and nothing they are not willing to desecrate or destroy in the process. Honor, respect, solemnity, truth, even national security are all expendable in their rabid minds if it means the chance to rule again.

I have been watching politics since about 1968 and I can tell you that the hatred today is as bad as it was back in the late 60's. When all were against the Vietnam War and when everything was McGovern, McGovern, McGovern. His biggest support came from the ratical left then too, as does John Kerry today. You would think they would learn from past mistakes but they do not.
I even remember how they turned the words around of Senator Barry Goldwater when asked if necessary would he use nuclear weapons, a question they asked all presidential nominees back then, to mean he was going to nuke North Vietnam.
Nothing has changed as far as the talking points of the extreme left are concerned, they pick what they want to hear and ignore the rest. The reality is that there are a lot more of them today than back then. Both in population, and in political office. But thanks to Rush Limbaugh we have a voice now and common sense always wins out over extremism.

The partisanship of the last 5 years is unparalleled in my memory (I'll be 60 soon) but the attack on Bush, per se, is not as venomous, as paranoid, and as filled with alarmist rhetoric as the the attack on Nixon in the summer of '64.
Each day brought a new story of how Nixon had threatened the principles that made our nation great, our nation itself, and the pillars of civilization. It was disgusting.

I concur. The Left is finite and it shall implode. Their worship of all that is evil and vile earns them an eternity in the flames of hell. Their failure to love and follow the Lord is deplorable. Their acceptance of the evils of faggotry and the opposition of George Bush clearly shows their path.

I too pray for these sinners. For once they accept the Lord and our country's administration we can gain the support to dominate the homeland for Jesus and spread His word to the world.

Statistically the leftists control the media waves, except for a few voices of reason. The democrats that I know only express the views of their party leaders, they don't get completely bent out of shape. It is a shame that Barry Goldwater was not elected instaed of Kennedy. The political turmoil has been witnessed by myself since that time . Minorities will always claim the trump card given to them by the leftist leaders that have adulterated the Constitution. I submit to everyone :Forget tax day. What would the media proponents do if the government had zero revenue? Belittle them? they already do that. Embrace them? they selectively do that. Beseech them? Never. Bankroll them? always. Bite them?
only when hand is extended.

Yesterday is what happens to a movement after it has accomplished its goals. In this case, the Civil Rights movement. Are race relations perfect here, or anywhere for that matter. Well no but most leaders of the Civil Rights movement today fail to ackowledge any progress. Why? Well to do so would require them to either pick a new cause or to give up their spotlight. Pure vanity.

With all due respect to Duane, I think Mark is spot on. I don't hate liberals, but I want them as far from the levers of power as possible, and I think 9 months from yesterday this country is going to experience a watershed event. Unless Democrats can offer some comprehensive solutions to the problems they are so vociferous in criticizing, they're toast come November. Boundless criticism, hate and vitriol are just not a winning strategy. Every time I see a poll that says the Donks are ahead, I take comfort in looking at the red/blue county map of the US in 2004.

The question that should always be raised when debating a Democrat who starts bashing a Bush plan or proposal is 'What is YOUR plan?'.

I'm sorry Mark, Retired Spook,

I don't think the liberals are any less patriotic then the right. In fact it continues to blow me away that you put the cause of the potential fracture at the feet of liberal when it has been conservatives who have presided over the disaster that is the last 5 years. And you continue to ignore it as if this administration is some how actually doing a good job. Did you look at Bush's proposed budget??? HOW as a self-proclaimed conservative are you NOT enraged???? $ 432 billion in the red in spite of significant cuts to programs for the needy. Is that fiscally conservative...is that consistent with your Christian values?

There are lots of reason to be upset, angered and outraged about things for the democrats starting with the Supreme Courts decision on the Presidential elections in 2000, to the facts of what the Clinton admin did to fight the war on terror compared with what the Bush admin did PER 9-11, to the hyped up intel for going to war in Iraq, to the bumbling of the fight and post -war efforts, to the huge deficit we have in spite of program cuts,
to the suppression of science reports by the administration, to the Rovian chicken-hawk Swift-boating of guys like McCain, Kerry and other actual decorated war vets, to Delay and Abramoff.

You are trying to tell us how dangerous the things the liberals are SAYING while ignoring the real things the Republicans are DOING. I've learned that actions speak loader then words.....it's the Republicans actions that concern me not the supposed ill intentions of the liberals as exposed by conservatives.

My plan would be to make it the equivalent of high treason for a President to cut taxes and simultaneously increase spending. Be clear that NO ONE has received a tax cut since Bush took office... Bush has simply taken a loan from your children to pay for a war and tons of other spending while never ONCE using his veto power to control pork spending. The people who have benefited the most from living and doing business in our democracy are not sacrificing for the war ...in fact they are getting huge tax cuts and a lot of war profits as well while the poorest join the military as their only way out of poverty and fight the wars and give their lives and limbs while Bush rewards the wealthiest with our childs money. Do you really feel that's proper???

The question that should always be raised when debating a Democrat who starts bashing a Bush plan or proposal is 'What is YOUR plan?'.

Posted by: Hermie at February 8, 2006 08:15 AM

As a visitor, and a fairly moderate person, I can view the statements made by both sides as somewhat hypocritical. In hypocritical, I mean everyone is accusing each other of the things they shout loudly at the other side of being exclusively responsible for.

However, Muirgeo mentions the past. And it's clear that many Democrats are so full of rage that they lost an election in 2000, that they personally hate George Bush with a passion. Eight years of Clinton led them to believe their way of thinking was indeed the natural order of things. They were further scared in 2002 and 2004 when they discovered that their vision of the world wasn't the vision the American people wished to put their faith in.

I must say that there was an article written and quoted on this site in 2004 about Deterrence. And the phrase, millions of Americans would rather hear bad ideas said well, then good ideas said poorly. We need leaders who will actually lead.

It seems Democrat leaders admit they don't have one voice, much less one plan to resolve the current "issues" facing the world.

We need serious leaders who will recognize we cannot change the past, fighting those fights are pointless. We need to say that today we offer this plan for the future. IF you're willing to offer suggestions that aren't just thinly veiled attacks at progress, than you'll be invited into the circle of decision making.

Muirgeo cannot see in his worldview that some Democrats are just as bad as some Republicans and vice versa. The hypocrisy of so many on the left should be countered on the left by those who wish to make the world a better place, instead of simply electoral politics.

Republicans are doing the business of the American people. Democrats are hanging out with Angelina Jolie in Davos threatening a filibuster of a well qualified judge simply because they disagree with his politics. Democrats are more concerned that 10 terrorists have had their international communications monitored (when this is perfectly legal to begin with) than they are about the safety of the American people.

Democrats are not unpatriotic, but they simply don't see the mortal danger that exists in this world today. Until that happens, "the better way will be the current way."

I was appalled by the lack of respect, dignity, and the outright spectacle of Coretta Scott King's funeral. What should have been a celebration of a wonderful woman's life instead turned into a political rally for the stupid.

Muirgeo,
You need to get into a 12-step program for delusional moonbats.

First step...is admitting you have a problem.

It might help you to read Michelle Malkin's book "Unhinged". It clearly documents the absolute vitriol towards President Bush and conservatives by the liberal progressive democrat party.

It wasn't republicans shooting out windows, breaking arms, ripping up signs, and slashing tires during the last election!

Principle trumps color

In other words, Lowery and others spoke the truth, the truth hurts, and you are now reeling in pain.

Love your latest meme about how "the left" is solely responsible for vitriol in politics. Because Bush certainly ran zero attack ads, right? No Republican claimed that John Kerry shot himself to get out of Vietnam, right? Republicans en masse didn't mock purple hearts with little band-aids at the GOP convention, right? It was Pat Leahy who told Dick Cheney to perform an act of autoeroticism, not the other way around, right?

Ah, what's the use. The truth never sinks in with you, Noonan--even when you're smacked over the head with it like Lowery did. Everything that was said at King's funeral was in line with the work King did when she was alive. And it got mentioned at her funeral--imagine that. It must suck to have that mirror held up to you so you can see just how ugly you really are and see just how much you stand opposed to the very justice the Kings fought for.

The problem isn't the left or the right, it's the idea that we are, as Mark puts it, "opponents". WHY?

Isn't there a way we can all work together?

If you substitute "right" for "left," Mark, I agree with everything you say.

There's hate on both sides. Many do hate Bush. Many hate Rove. Many, especially here, hate Hillary Clinton and Ted Kennedy.

"For our opponents on the left, the only thing I can see motivating them is hatred - nasty, snide, spiteful hatred."

With a rotten attitude like that, that's all you'll ever allow yourself to see.

"but I never would have imagined that the funeral of Mrs. King was the place to talk about the NSA program, the Katrina disaster, or the war in Iraq... "

This was pretty much the question Tucker Carlson asked Rev. Dr. Joseph Lowery today.

Rev. Lowry said he talked about these things because they were the issues that Mrs King was most concerned about in her last days. He said this what Mrs. King was all about, what she dedicated her life to.

Considering he was a long time close friend of hers, I think it is very wrong for any of us to assume to tell him how to remember her.

Neither of us are African American, but I do understand they approach funerals differently. As do Jews, as do Chinese, etc.

How graceful of the King family to invite Bush 41 (who actively campaigned against civil rights) and Bush 43. How graceful. We could all take a lesson from them.

"Rev. Lowry said he talked about these things because they were the issues that Mrs King was most concerned about in her last days. He said this what Mrs. King was all about, what she dedicated her life to."

DeeCee, this makes no sense. No one remembers Corretta King for "dedicating her life to" talking about Iraq or Katrina. She had much bigger fish to fry.

--

Mark, you are much too optimistic. The Democrats will unfortunately be around for a long time.

For our opponents on the left, the only thing I can see motivating them is hatred - nasty, snide, spiteful hatred. I haven't, thank God, been to a lot of funerals so far in my life

First of all, Mark, I have seen many funerals in my life and I am only in my early fifties. A number of those funerals were for young disabled Americans who should be alive today, but they were sacrificed so that the able bodied could have their tax cuts. It's not for me to judge them though, it's God's decision; but what I do have a problem with is these past and present US Presidents pushing their way into a funeral with their secret service and paparazzi. A funeral is only for family, friends, and co-workers; not for some politician to say how they loved or respected the deceased or their life's work to impress the crowds that they are really nice. As Jesus says, they (the politicians) have had their reward. Possibly Carter actually knew her, and as such, had a right to be there; but the others: Bush Sr, Clinton, and George W Bush had absolutely no right to be there. In all the funerals I've attended, I've never seen a US President, US Senator, Governor, or even City Council member there. Apparently these people that I loved and grieved for are not important enough to merit a President's time. But God is no "respecter of persons."

As for condemning "nasty, snide, spiteful hatred", I agree that there has been a huge increase of it in the past 25 years, mostly coming from the right. Do you remember the intense personal attacks on Tip O'Neill? Or when Barbara Bush called Geraldine Ferraro a "bitch" in the national media? Tax payer funded attacks on President Clinton? The vicious, hate-filled attacks on Gore, Kerry, and Max Cleland? But the right will not even tolerate any in the GOP who will vary from their dogma, even once; as when President Bush (Sr) OK'ed a one time tax hike, or when Nixon suggested national health insurance. In this they remind me of the Stalinists. Lenin wanted Trotsky as his successor, but Stalin sneakily took over, and eventually Trotsky left, ending up in Mexico. Was Stalin content with total power? No, he had agents go to Mexico to kill Trotsky twice, the second time finally being successful. That obsessive need for absolute dominance seems very common in the right. In another thread on this site I asked "isn't it enough that you won?" (whatever the issue was) and got back from someone something like "no, it's not enough to win; we have to crush liberal scum like you." That kind of attitude will not, as they say, "win friends and influence people."

Wow. This has been very interesting. I posted on this blog yesterday. This was the first time I have ever posted a message on a blog, or even really read one for that matter. I’m an American who has worked and lived in Tokyo for the past 14 years. I meet and talk with people from all over the world, including folks from back home from all over the country.

I must say that, though the views held by the people I meet and talk with here are as varied as the views I read on this thread (minus, thankfully, the view that the US become a “homeland for Jesus”, haven’t come across that one), across the political spectrum, here people I run into seem to have room in their intellect for opposing views.

Mark Noonan wrote, “Hatred and evil live in the heart of every person”. I am sure this is true. But when he goes on to say that the left is “motivated entirely by hatred” and “brings out the worst in all of us”, does that not sort of dampen, if not end, any meaningful dialogue between “left” and “right”.

“Retired Spook” expressed his or her agreement with Mr. Noonan and I would ask them both to think about this. One would have to have a very dim view of humanity in general to believe that this large segment of our population (the left) is motivated by hatred. It is simply not true. This is not, I assure you, some optimistic, starry-eyed belief in the goodness of human nature on my part. No, this is based on experience. I have seen a bit of the world, and more importantly spoken with Americans and others of every stripe, and my observations just don’t bear out the idea that large numbers of humans are motivated by hatred.

As far as I can tell, most people I speak with about America whether they are “left” or “right”, do not seem to be motivated by hatred. From say the button-down corporate expatriate I may chat with in a pub over a Gunnies, to the long hair backpacker exploring Asia who starts up a conversation after I’ve given him or her directions on a Tokyo street, I don’t see hatred as a motivating force behind the views of Americans.

I don’t like to label myself, but for the sake of making a point, I’ll call myself a member of the left. I am not motivated by hatred. Let me just say that once again so there is no ambiguity, I am not motivated by hatred. So “Retired Spook” and Mr. Noonan, here is at least one person, on the left, who is not motivated by hatred.

To be honest, and as I’ve written I am new to blogging, this thread is one of the first places I’ve participated in a “discussion” and been exposed to any views expressed which I suspect may indeed be motivated by hatred. Not, in particular, the posts by Mark Noonan or “Retired Spook”, whom it appears to me only have a misunderstanding of the left, but in other posts.